Optimal BRD rotation?

[Dervy]

One parse doesn't necessarily mean it's superior, not by a long shot. Parsing for optimal rotations literally means nothing as it does not take into account the rng that comes with your standard hit ranges, crit% or the bl proc chance.

For some reason, your DoT opener parsed higher min/max hits than when you used Krietors opener and this is shown in both Auto-Attacks and your out-going abilities. The crit% on both parses are also noticeably varied and your opener also had a lot more hits registered, despite it being a shorter parse, which is odd to say the least. All of these would affect the DPS of the parses.

[treuhavik]

(...)and your opener also had a lot more hits registered, despite it being a shorter parse, which is odd to say the least. All of these would affect the DPS of the parses.

This could be due to Bloodletter procs. As to what caused the spike in DPS toward the end, it could be several procs or buffs comming off cooldown just in time to make the cut.


SlyRoyale, you'd need to run at least 10 parses on each opener and find an average for each to even begin to make a case for either.

[SlyRoyale]

Thing is, other bards I've talked to have tried out both openers and the most common finding they've noticed is that the DoT opener is usually 10 DPS greater than Krietor's. It's a small increase, but still an increase that they've noticed. The parses I've posted do not stray from that trend in any significant way.

Not to besmirch Krietor's opener, but it's spike damage would be better suited for fights that ask for it. The DoT opener would be more for endurance-style fights, which is what the FCoB turns are. It's the latter why I prefer opening with DoTs over Straight Shot and the proof shows.

[SlyRoyale]

You missed another point of the opener. Krietor's opener is based on spike damage, whereas the DoT opener guarantees full strength of the second set of DoTs. This means the DoT opener is better for sustaining high damage over longer periods of time, whereas Krietor's spikes and drops off. In the long run, that would result in lower DPS. Also, your estimate still misses a vital point: while it may be -15DPS weaker than it should be as you claim, it is still stronger than Krietor's in the long run.

[Ooshima]

You missed another point of the opener. Krietor's opener is based on spike damage, whereas the DoT opener guarantees full strength of the second set of DoTs. This means the DoT opener is better for sustaining high damage over longer periods of time, whereas Krietor's spikes and drops off. In the long run, that would result in lower DPS. Also, your estimate still misses a vital point: while it may be -15DPS weaker than it should be as you claim, it is still stronger than Krietor's in the long run.

I'm not using Krietor's opener BTW, I have my own set of opener after my own series of tests and speaking/exploring with some of my FC BRDs who really excels in the job (they achieved server firsts). I briefly read Krietor's guide but I don't really agree with it. My opener ensure full strength of my DoTs with X-pot right from the start, without any clipping. Krietor's guide deploys the same concept of opening with buffed DoTs but he suggests to clip at around 6s which is a waste of DPS.

With regards to your statement, it's not correct because BRD's long term DPS stabilizes after 1 min in general, after the first cycle of your CDs, unless you are lucky with crit hits and BL procs you might sustain 500 plus minus DPS for 2 mins max. Refer to the DPS-over-time graph and you can see that after the 30th sec mark the graph area and pattern are pretty much the same. There's isn't any variation after that, because BRDs doesn't have combos.

As a comparison, when patch 2.4 just came out not long ago, I did a series of test with my crafted gear and Nexus. IL was 106, with 40+% crit rate, 3mins parse without using the refreshed Hawk's Eye at the end, I was able to get 44X on dummy reliably (half of the time). Lower end parse was about 435 ish if BL proc sucks.

[SlyRoyale]

I briefly read Krietor's guide but I don't really agree with it. My opener ensure full strength of my DoTs with X-pot right from the start, without any clipping. Krietor's guide deploys the same concept of opening with buffed DoTs but he suggests to clip at around 6s which is a waste of DPS.

Well, at least we can agree that the clipping is a DPS loss. However, something about all of this is seriously nagging at me. It doesn't add up. It appears that while I'm focusing on sustained damage, the rest of you are more focused on spike damage. If you ask me, I don't believe that's a good basis to go by.

Would it be alright if you post your opener? If not here, I'm available on Steam throughout most of the day. My Steam ID is the same as my SE ID here.

[Ooshima]

Well, at least we can agree that the clipping is a DPS loss. However, something about all of this is seriously nagging at me. It doesn't add up. It appears that while I'm focusing on sustained damage, the rest of you are more focused on spike damage. If you ask me, I don't believe that's a good basis to go by.

Would it be alright if you post your opener? If not here, I'm available on Steam throughout most of the day. My Steam ID is the same as my SE ID here.

Unfortunately I'm not on Steam (nor use it) so I can't be there.

Anyways I don't think there's really a thing called spike/sustained for BRD. Eventually it comes down to the application of buffs and ensuring that your DoTs are always buffed when possible, and a priority system. We don't have a large standard deviation in our damage range and what causes the most deviation is BL procs.

However, what makes a significant difference here is that in an actual battle, like coil, you have to incorporate X-Pot usage into your buff rotation and opener. In your DoT opener, it is a waste of X-Pot time because aren't fully abusing it. If you are trying to do those things and "spreading things out" for so called "sustained damage" then you aren't maximizing your pot. That is why you will see top end game bards deploy an opener that allows them to dump the most amount of damage possible from the start, fully utilizing the X-Pot buff. The most ideal situation is having Raging Strikes, IR , Hawk's Eye and BfB up for the entire duration of the X-Pot, fully abusing it and hoping that you get BL procs and Straighter Shot procs. For me, if I get lucky with procs during openers, I may very well be floating around 480-510 ish range with the crappy IL120 bow and around IL113ish gears for 1.5 mins to 2 mins into the fight before normalizing.

As a side talk, can't wait to get the Yoichi Bow and see more pewpewpew. No intention to upgrade the Magitek Bow, just going to use twine for armor.

[rappa]

Monday i saw my first 4 numbers damage



Poor Bennu, he suffered all my bufs up ;...;

]----[

About upgrade the ironwork bow i think the same.

Priority is other dps than me and i prefer upgrade boots or helm

[SlyRoyale]

Unfortunately I'm not on Steam (nor use it) so I can't be there.

Damn. Would it be possible to make an alt on Tonberry and ask you there, or would that be too much of a hassle? I'd like to get to the bottom of this and see every single piece of evidence I can gather on which opener is stronger (yours or the DoT, since Krietor's isn't that good). A parse or two from your end is welcome, but I'm the kind of person who wants to experience things for their own.

The most ideal situation is having Raging Strikes, IR , Hawk's Eye and BfB up for the entire duration of the X-Pot, fully abusing it and hoping that you get BL procs and Straighter Shot procs. For me, if I get lucky with procs during openers, I may very well be floating around 480-510 ish range with the crappy IL120 bow and around IL113ish gears for 1.5 mins to 2 mins into the fight before normalizing.

Hrm, it is my understanding that BRDs can squeeze in two buffs between GCDs pending on their skill speed. If I wanted to make full use of it in my DoT opener, I would have to use Raging Strikes where Blunt Arrow would be used, then pop Blood for Blood and a potion after the next GCD (WB + BL > VB + HE + RS > SS + BfB + pot...). That might result in not using a GCD when you're supposed to due to animation locking from the potion. They're usually hard to weave in, but I imagine that's just a timing issue.

Either way, the sooner I can put this behind me the better. If there's ways to improve my numbers and performance, I will not hesitate to seek them out and challenge them to see where they stand.

[AkashiXI]

Unfortunately I'm not on Steam (nor use it) so I can't be there. Anyways I don't think there's really a thing called spike/sustained for BRD. Eventually it comes down to the application of buffs and ensuring that your DoTs are always buffed when possible, and a priority system. We don't have a large standard deviation in our damage range and what causes the most deviation is BL procs.

However, what makes a significant difference here is that in an actual battle, like coil, you have to incorporate X-Pot usage into your buff rotation and opener. In your DoT opener, it is a waste of X-Pot time because aren't fully abusing it. If you are trying to do those things and "spreading things out" for so called "sustained damage" then you aren't maximizing your pot. That is why you will see top end game bards deploy an opener that allows them to dump the most amount of damage possible from the start, fully utilizing the X-Pot buff.ve seen it, and I've been interested for awhile. The most ideal situation is having Raging Strikes, IR , Hawk's Eye and BfB up for the entire duration of the X-Pot, fully abusing it and hoping that you get BL procs and Straighter Shot procs. For me, if I get lucky with procs during openers, I may very well be floating around 480-510 ish range with the crappy IL120 bow and around IL113ish gears for 1.5 mins to 2 mins into the fight before normalizing.

As a side talk, can't wait to get the Yoichi Bow and see more pewpewpew. No intention to upgrade the Magitek Bow, just going to use twine for armor.

Have you ever posted your opener? I don't think I've seen it, and I'm curious what it is.