The Ninja Superthread

[treuhavik]

It's hard nailing down the perfect opener and even harder executing that opener every single time. With enough warning, I'm able to pull off a Suiton or Aiurily's second opener, but in the field I'm usually caught casting Huton as the tank is pulling and have go for something like B4B > SE > Jugulate > SF > IR > Mutilate > SE > GS > DE or AE > Suiton > SE > TA > SF and I'm still managing to hold 420 DPS in T9 - 440 on Shiva.

IMO, as long as you're getting everything up that needs getting up, your DPS will level out around the same number throughout the course of the fight. The opener you use can increase that number slightly but, from what I've seen, it mainly determines your initial burst. Though, it could just be my inconsistency in which opener I use.



UPDATE: Added BiS sets for each food type

[treuhavik]

I know this is a MNK thread but... For your sheet, Dervy:

Thanks a bunch! Is that in the excel sheet I linked, or in a separate spreadsheet? And could you upload it for me? It'll help speed up things when I start making the NIN sim.

Yep, it's in the main file. http://www.filedropper.com/ff14pps1

Shift the conversation to the NIN thread. Don't want to flood here

So, in the simulation, should I use base GCD (2.49) in the time column?

EDIT: Nvm, I found where you/emx plugged in

[Dervy]

No. The GDC is actually calculated from the SS you're using in Z1. But it isn't as easy as plugging in numbers. You need to take into account Huton which has a specific duration, Kiss of the Wasp/Viper, -10% resists, BFB/IR,oCDs and the sim is set-up so it checks buffs/skills at every interval of the rotation and allows you to freely change the order of abilities, instead of hard coding it. It has a VERY steep learning curve.

As I said, I'll set it up as I'll need to check it through many times and thoroughly test it for accuracy before I want to give out weights for it. I hate giving out half finished or inaccurate numbers. Don't stress yourself with trying to calculate weights at the moment

[treuhavik]

No. The GDC is actually calculated from the SS you're using in Z1. But it isn't as easy as plugging in numbers. You need to take into account Huton which has a specific duration, Kiss of the Wasp/Viper, -10% resists, BFB/IR,oCDs and the sim is set-up so it checks buffs/skills at every interval of the rotation and allows you to freely change the order of abilities, instead of hard coding it. It has a VERY steep learning curve.

As I said, I'll set it up as I'll need to check it through many times and thoroughly test it for accuracy before I want to give out weights for it. I hate giving out half finished or inaccurate numbers. Don't stress yourself with trying to calculate weights at the moment

I'll leave it to you then. Though, won't we need to establish a concrete 'rotation' to even begin the sim?

[Dervy]

Actually, the opposite You need a sim to work out the rotation.

Edit: Noob questions.

1) Is there ever a moment where you'd want to switch between Kiss of the Viper/Wasp, other than for the additional effect on Mug/Jugulate?
2) Huton. Can that be 100% sustained without any DPS downtime?
3) Talking of downtime, what is the GDC downtime when using your Mudras?

[treuhavik]

Noob questions.

1) Is there ever a moment where you'd want to switch between Kiss of the Viper/Wasp, other than for the additional effect on Mug/Jugulate?
2) Huton. Can that be 100% sustained without any DPS downtime?
3) Talking of downtime, what is the GDC downtime when using your Mudras?

1) Well, that's only difference. Unless you're on stun duty or farming open-world-mobs, the heal from mug is more beneficial.

2) With the way murdras relate to the game server, no. However, Huton should be up 100% of the time, so account for that. All ninjutsu casts (in a raid environment at least) will cut into the GCD, which leads to question #3...

3) The amount of time it takes to cast ninjutsu varies player to player, depending entirely on your connection to the game server. For me, it takes between 2.5 and 3 seconds per cast, and as my GCD is @ 2.01 with Huton, it eats a good second of my GCD every 20 seconds.

[Aiurily]

Actually, the opposite You need a sim to work out the rotation.

Noob question. Is there ever a moment where you'd want to switch between Kiss of the Viper/Wasp, other than for the additional effect on Mug/Jugulate?

in any meaningful way? not really; the only difference is on jugulate/mug anyway. you'd mostly always be using viper in raid content, but you can put on wasp to stun adds for 2s on shiva ex and switch back to viper afterwards; and you probably should switch from viper to wasp for dreadknights on t5.

but it's all really minor lol. in open world or dungeons wasp is nice for the stun, for positionals, cc or interrupts (satasha hm first boss if no one else is going to stun for example)

[Best-MNK-NA]

In a raid situation you're probably looking at 3 seconds for a mudra cast, it can be done at 2-2.5s sometimes. I figure it's better to estimate stat weights on the low side/given bad conditions, so go with 3 seconds for mudra.

[Dervy]

thanks for your help guys.

Just need to think of a way to effectively add Mudra's to this model and include the GDC downtime of using them, then a first iteration of a NIN sim should be working. I'd need to do some thorough testing and check that all of the data I plugged in is correct (Just found a mistake with the duration of Mutilate I used...) but that'll come after I've hit 50 on my nin, so give me another week or so to finish it up.

Also, could someone me a link to their lodestone so I can see their gear, as well as the number of their parsed DPS?

[treuhavik]

Also, could someone me a link to their lodestone so I can see their gear, as well as the number of their parsed DPS?

Getting just under 700 initial burst and 505ish sustained now using Shaolin Mike's rotation (Huton pre-pull > SE > B4B > GS > IR > DE > Suiton > Multilate > Trick Attack > SE > Kassatsu > SF > Raiton > SE > Mug > GS > Jugulate > AE)

http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/OUMD No food, party or pots

Will this work?

EDIT: Here's lodestone - http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...racter/515208/

EDIT2:

Should swap mutilate and shadow fangs order,

Huton pre-pull > SE > B4B > GS > IR > DE > Suiton > SE* > Trick Attack > SF* > Kassatsu > Mutilate* > Raiton > SE > Mug > GS > Jugulate > AE.

That way your dots are all being affected by trick attack.

I think this is what I was doing by "mistake" when testing that opener.

EDIT3: I'm running more parse now using this rotation. I'll post my results and a screenshot of the parse if I can get prtscn to work.