The Ninja Superthread

[treuhavik]

Heya, great post, thanks for this!

Just a couple things...

(Impulse Drive)

You lose access to this cross-class skill when you transition from ROG to NIN.

(Stat Weights - STR)

You mean DEX, right?

Thanks again!

Thanks for catching those!

I've also updated the rotation section of the OP:

The NIN's GDC layout is scarily similar to that of a Dragoon... The priority can actually loop - though the loop is much longer then that of the Dragoon.

SE - GS - DE - SF - M - SE - GS - AE
SE - GS - DE - SF - SE - GS - AE
SE - GS - DE - M - SF - SE - GS - AE
SE - GS - DE - SF - SE - GS - AE - M
SE - GS - DE - SF - SE - GS - AE

Note: This list was created with 100% Huton up-time and a total skill speed of 436 in mind.

This "rotation" is merely a base with which to work with. Your full rotation, once added the Ninjutsu rotation, buffs and oGCDs, can, and most likely will, vary from the Ninja next to you. However the base of this rotation will remain the same, as it is simply listed in the order in which your debuff and DoTs will fall off and need to be refreshed, hence "priority". Be sure to put them up in the order in which you see them here, as that just so happens to be the most effective method.

DE > SF > M > AE - This is your priority chain. If the first one is up, move to the next, so-on and so-forth. The one exception to this rule would be in the event you need to break away from your main target. This is the only time it is more efficient to place your DoTs (SF > M) without your slashing debuff (DE) due to time constraints. Of course, if anticipated in advance, try and have DE up before hand.

Ninjutsu Rotation

Single Target:

First, Huton should always be up before engaging and, ideally, re-applied within 19-3 seconds remaining on your Huton buff.

The second ninjutsu you'll want to use is Suiton. This enables you to use Trick Attack without hide and while already engaged, granting you and your party 10% more damage against the affected target.

Following your Suiton cast, common practice is to activate Kassastu. This resets your ninjutsu recast and guarantees the next cast will be a critical hit. The best spell to use in combination with Kassatsu has proven to be Raiton, as it is the highest potency ninjutsu spell, therefore granting it the greatest benefit from the critical bonus.

Depending on your chosen opener/rotation and granted proper timing of your ninjutsu casts, you will be able to fire a second Raiton (still your highest potency spell). In order to do this properly, your Huton buff must have at least 20+ seconds remaining, else it will drop off and your damage suffer for it.

So remember, Huton (when buff is under 23 seconds) > Suiton (when TA is available) > Raition (with Kassatsu when available directly after a cast)


Opener(s):

Now that we've taken a look at all the individual pieces of Ninja, let's put it all together. Welcome to "openers", which are used to start off the battle and our priority rotations. Once executed, everything should flow naturally, granted you are following the priorities listed above. You are following them aren't you? Oh, Of course you are...

So, here we have openers shared by fellow Ninjas. Just by taking a quick glance, you can already see how varied the rotation can become. Take your time, find one you like or even create one of your own. Just be sure to keep up your buffs, debuffs and DoTs, and share it with the rest of us if you think you've struck gold. If you can ever use it, never shy away from asking for advice, I didn't type this thing to help myself and there are many others here to help as well.

[PROBOUND]

SE - GS - DE - SF - M - SE - GS - AE

I also made a tooltip legend similar to the DRG's TTT setup to help me memorize it. In your above line you leave out SE before the SF. This is fine cuz most Ninja's will understand you cant apply Fang without SE but might i suggest removing SE and GS and perhaps M from the legend altogether for simplicity. I find this slightly easier on the brain since its pretty self explanatory to refresh your Mutliate and 1-2 combo starters. I applaud your efforts here.

Eg:
D = Dancing Combo
F = Fang Combo
A = Aeolian Combo
- = Mutilate etc.

(rotation is probably off just an example)

D - F - A
F - D - A
F - D - A
F - D - A

[treuhavik]

Eg:
D = Dancing Combo
F = Fang Combo
A = Aeolian Combo
- = Mutilate etc.

(rotation is probably off just an example)

D - F - A
F - D - A
F - D - A
F - D - A

You have a point. It is a bit intimidating to look at, I'll admit. While I really like your version, I'm trying to lay it out as clearly as possible for the newer players and I feel as though the colored hyphens may go unnoticed. I also don't want to mislead anyone into using these actions outside of their combo chains - I'll add some detail to the legend.

Here we are.

OP Updated;

The Priority Rotation

The NIN's GDC layout is scarily similar to that of a Dragoon... The priority can actually loop - though the loop is much longer then that of the Dragoon.

Note: Dervy created this listing with 100% Huton up-time and a total skill speed of 436 in mind.

To better show the breakdown of this layout, we'll use a different legend for this section...and add some color while we're at it!

D: Dancing Combo (Spinning Edge > Gust Slash > Dancing Edge)
A: Aeolian Combo (Spinning Edge > Gust Slash > Aeolian Edge)
F: Fang Combo (Spinning Edge > Shadow Fang)
M: Mutilate

D - F - M - A
D - F - A
D - M - F - A
D - F - A - M
D - F - A --> Repeat


This "rotation" is merely a base with which to work with. Your full rotation, once added the Ninjutsu rotation, buffs and oGCDs, can, and most likely will, vary from the Ninja next to you. However the base of this rotation will remain the same, as it is simply listed in the order in which your debuff and DoTs will fall off and need to be refreshed, hence "priority". Be sure to put them up in the order in which you see them here, as that just so happens to be the most effective method.

D > F > M > A - This is your priority chain. If the first one is up, move to the next, so-on and so-forth. The one exception to this rule would be in the event you need to break away from your main target. This is the only time it is more efficient to place your DoTs (F > M) without your slashing debuff (D) due to time constraints. Of course, if anticipated in advance, try and have D up before hand.

[PROBOUND]

Snip

Much better thx! I think thats alot less daunting to look at and will be very easy to memorize.

[Butcherboy]

And dervy hit a home run ty for the stat weight as I have been looking for this specific just for ninja. Ty

[Dervy]

And dervy hit a home run ty for the stat weight as I have been looking for this specific just for ninja. Ty

Aaaand now time to add the finishing touches to the NIN sim entirely (little bits and bobs I don't like)... Then off to rework Bard.... Then make a Summoner Sim. T0rins sim for the summoner is really outdated and sim.ffxivguild.com doesn't work as well as I'd like it to. I want everything ready for the Expansion as there's going to be A LOT of confusing and debates... Something needs to sort that mess out :P

I'm skipping BLM and leaving that one to PuroStrider. His work for that Job is beyond anything I'd ever be able to do.

[Archadius]

A Note on Cross-Class Skills

I've done some experimenting and thought I'd lay out the details/usefulness of each cross-class skill, and a conclusion as to which ones I feel are most beneficial to include in the rotation:

Lv.4 Featherfoot, Pugilist
(Good for solo perhaps, but in most (party-based) situations, a waste of a slot. Evasion bonuses don't help you much in a party, you're a DPS, not a tank)

*Lv.8 Second Wind, Pugilist
(Good for solo purposes as well as helping out your healer when those pesky "unavoidable" attacks strike, or if you mess up and get hit by something you shouldn't have)

Lv.10 Haymaker, Pugilist
(Good for solo perhaps, but in most (party-based) situations, a waste of a slot. The fact you need to evade an attack to proc this ability makes it rarely used since you're a DPS, not a tank)

*Lv.12 Internal Release, Pugilist
(Self-buff to DPS, an absolute must-have)

Lv.42 Mantra, Pugilist
(Decent for party play, but in most situations you may find it unecessary. The buff duration is low, and at best it's offering a rather small bonus to healing aptitude. Chances are your healer is more than capable of managing your party's HP without the help of this buff. I'd recommend it for a party of 8 that are melee DPS heavy, but not one with several ranged DPS or for a party of 4)

*Lv.2 Feint, Lancer
(Good for solo and party based situations. It's basically Haymaker without the need to evade for a proc. It can be highly useful since slowing the mob help keeps you and/or your party alive, and it shares the GCD so it's always ready)

Lv.6 Keen Flurry, Lancer
(Good for solo perhaps, but in most (party-based) situations, a waste of a slot. Parry bonuses don't help you much in a party, you're a DPS, not a tank)

*Lv.22 Invigorate, Lancer
(Good for solo and party based situations. With Huton up you may notice that you really start to fly through your rotation, and may fall short of TP on occasion. This also helps when you're spamming Death Blossom to burn down several trash mobs)

*Lv.34 Blood for Blood, Lancer
(Self-buff to DPS, an absolute must-have)

*These are the 5 I've chosen, with swapping Second Wind for Mantra in those situations where it would benefit my melee-heavy party.

[treuhavik]

A Note on Cross-Class Skills

I've done some experimenting and thought I'd lay out the details/usefulness of each cross-class skill, and a conclusion as to which ones I feel are most beneficial to include in the rotation:

These are the 5 I've chosen, with swapping Second Wind for Mantra in those situations where it would benefit my melee-heavy party.

Thanks! I agree with 4/5 of these, as Feint generally doesn't have an effect on high-level enemies and uses the GCD. Otherwise great list! I've noted the 4 must-haves in the OP.

[Leonus]

So any kind of disconnect from the boss, you should prioritize F > M > D or is that just for adds, and when you get back to the boss, you go back to D > F > M (when D has already fallen off.)

This is something that should be specified so that people know what to do for disconnects like these. Though it might be mostly judgement based.

[Arkenne]

Another Tip:
As an alternative opener specially good for Hunts I would recomend taking into account Hide and Kassatsu reset utility for the sake of Trick Attack:

- [Huton -> Be a Ninja and get close unnoticed -> Hide -> Trick Attack]<- All this within the first 10s of Huton.
- Do your Ninja magic while pushing your Huton until Trick Attack is within 10 seconds of reset
- [Huton -> Kassatsu -> Suiton -> Trick Attack]
- Continue with your Ninja magic

This will allow Trick Attack to be windowed at the 0~20 and 60~80 seconds in battle instead of the normal 20~30 and 80~90, and specially the first one will catch more of your whole party CDs and bursts (and all the other ppl doing the same Hunt Mark).

«All for One, United We Stand»