Real Money to Get In-Game Currency: Eternal Bond Edition

[ChibiChan_Hyperion]

Real money being used to acquire gil is NOT RMT no matter how you spin it. By buying the game and paying a subscription to SE, and being rewarded all the time in gil is all part of the game, and getting gil in game for you money is the default. It is using gil to acquire real money that makes it RMT. Gil sellers do this, and that is when it is RMT. Having only half of it is NOT RMT.

Let's look at Square Enix's definition (the only one that matters): "RMT is defined as the selling and buying of virtual assets for real-world money."

Now let's look at a party finder entry: "WTS Promise of Devotion (Platinum) for 3m." Now let's simplify it to make it simple: "WTS $20 for 3m." So, here we have someone exchanging 3m of in-game currency for $20. I think this is pretty clear cut. As such, the seller is spending $20 to acquire the 3m gil. Following logically when reversed, the buyer has just sold 3m gil for $20. This is how some people are seeing it (including myself).

That is your stance, there is no truth or validity to this position. As much as I like to keep the two separate, to say only game time matters is unjustifiably unfair to those with limited play time, even the devs made this very clear, that players at all level and varying time investment levels should be all be able to have a good time, enjoy the game, and make progress at a reasonable rate. Additionally having real life friends join you in game is one of the obvious advantage of real life carrying over into game.

You have mistaken my wording for a different meaning; I was saying that the time you spend working outside of the game should not somehow also progress your character in the game due to the time spent working outside of the game. I was not saying what you were implying here, the quoted user was trying to say they earned the cash outside of the game and should be able to use it as gil in the game. Which is not true, they should have to work for the gil in the game not outside of it. Edited to hopefully make more clear.

[Ophie-Mio]

Selling an item in game for in-game currency is certainly NOT RMT, it is in-game trading with in-game currency. Buying an item from the cash shop is NOT RMT.

Duh and more duh.

Buying the item from the cash shop and selling it for gil

...IS RMT.
No matter how you babble on. Buying an item with real money for the express purpose of selling it for gil, IS RMT. It is a trade off made with real money. I don't care how you decide to twist it in your head, it is RMT.
The rest of the sentence is you literally wording it in a way that pleases your argument.

What it does is distort the distribution of gil for a short time

Also what happens to the in-game economy when RMT comes into play.

Real money being used to acquire gil is NOT RMT no matter how you spin it.

Excep that this IS the actual definition of what RMT is.

the size of your wallet is not supposed to be able to determine your in game performance

That is your stance, there is no truth or validity to this position.

As Yoshi-P himself has stated. FFXIV is not a Pay to Win game. Given his own words, Ai Hana, your stance is the incorrect one. The size of your real life wallet and how it can profit you in this game, SHOULD NEVER come up.

[abzoluut]

Am I the only one who think that SE knew this beforehand and already planned to have some GM make a politic correct reply so it looks like they really intend for this not to happen?

It's like how people still think it's hard for SE to track gil buyers.

I think the hype for these bracelets will go down quickly. At least people can have them w/o supporting the cash shop. Oh wait..

[Giantbane]

Trading Gil for cash shop purchased items does not create the $$ incentives that drive gil farmers to flood the economy with gil that leads to hyperinflation. I don't have a problem with it. It also gives access to cash shop items to those players that do not want to spend their own RL $$ on "optional" items (whatever their reasons may be).

[Lior]

Trading Gil for cash shop purchased items does not create the $$ incentives that drive gil farmers to flood the economy with gil that leads to hyperinflation. I don't have a problem with it. It also gives access to cash shop items to those players that do not want to spend their own RL $$ on "optional" items (whatever their reasons may be).

I'll concede that I would be less averse to this if all cash shop items were tradeable. I think in that case the circulation of gil would even out more than it can with a limited item like wedding bands. It drives business away from gil farmers, and gives more options to players on both sides of the fence. It would also allow for scenarios in which, for example, someone can't afford a $40 wedding nor the in-game cost, but might be able to supplement the gil they do have by selling a lower cost cash shop item in-game in order to then buy the wedding bands in-game. It's still all a bit too much like what is seen in f2p titles for my liking, but if we're going to go this route I'd rather open up the entire cash shop to this sort of trade than have it be limited to this particular instance.

That said, such a system still inevitably favors the wealthy in real-life. The terms of generating money are a little more fair in-game, whereas I might be able to spend what amounts to 15 minutes of RL work for 4-5 million gil, and that same amount is equivalent to 3 hours of RL work for another player.

[Airget]

This thought came to mind in light of this ability to sell the bonds for in game currency.

Maybe the best way to counter this it to reward loyal subscribers with funds to purchase items from the cash shop. By this I mean something as simple as a 10 dollar fund that can only be used in the cash shop and you obtain as a loyalty reward for every 6 months subscribed.

So basically you get 20 a year, 5 short of buying mount, enough to buy 1 plat bond or 2 gold bonds, enough to buy 2 phials or purchase 20 dyes.

Heck it even be just the right number to purchase all 4 minions.

I think it could be a potential happy compromise, leave the bonds sellable as is but allowing a loyalty benefit for time subbed would add incentive to stay subbed and feel like they aren't having to spend extra cash to obtain the cash shop items.

[Gaelu]

This thought came to mind in light of this ability to sell the bonds for in game currency.

Maybe the best way to counter this it to reward loyal subscribers with funds to purchase items from the cash shop. By this I mean something as simple as a 10 dollar fund that can only be used in the cash shop and you obtain as a loyalty reward for every 6 months subscribed.

So basically you get 20 a year, 5 short of buying mount, enough to buy 1 plat bond or 2 gold bonds, enough to buy 2 phials or purchase 20 dyes.

Heck it even be just the right number to purchase all 4 minions.

I think it could be a potential happy compromise, leave the bonds sellable as is but allowing a loyalty benefit for time subbed would add incentive to stay subbed and feel like they aren't having to spend extra cash to obtain the cash shop items.

if this was the case, i'd be happy and keep on playing. i really like this idea.

EDIT: OR, we could just remove the cash shop... *hush* let a man dream....

[Wildsprite]

As you know, the promise wristlets were designed to be tradable so that one person would be able to purchase a pair of wristlets and gift one to their partner.

While the trading and selling of these items for gil is not against the terms of service, in the event this type of trend continues and topics continue to arise regarding whether or not this is considered real-money trading, we will have no choice but to change the design of this system. Therefore we would like players to stop selling and trading the bracelets for gil so that they can continue to be used for their intended purpose.

I have a solution.
first make it so only 1 set of 2 wristlets can be bought from each premium tree(this should be incase the person changes their mind later and wants a better package)
second make the wristlets unique/untradable.
third make it so you have to select your partner from a list of friends on the mogstation
forth make is so should you lose said item for whatever reason they can be bought chealy from the calamity salvager

the first 3 would kill the whole idea of people buying the wristlets and selling them.
don't bother making the free ones untradable, they are free afterall.

[Silversnow]

The only opinion I have on this is how much of a joke they made the mechanics of this. What *should* have happened is the single wristlet option gets auto bound to the selected character with an option to pair to another once only. If you get the two wristlet option then one of them gets auto bound to you and the second one remains transferable yet is paired ONLY to the buyers by default. A window can pop up with a giant warning about accepting the proposal binds the wristlet to you.

I honestly don't think they counted on their players being so scummy as to turn a fun thing into an rmt option. The system IS going to change though as I can see the rmt people using their stolen CC's to open an account, buy wristlets, and sell them off as fast as possible before the cards are reported stolen. Legit players are going to end up with lost gil and revoked wristlets with the current system.

[HeroSamson]

Bayohne just gave a response and says its fine to sell it for Gil but people are still going on about it.

It is not like you cannot do it yourself unless you are under age and parents wont let you use their credit card for cash shop.

makes me wonder.