A Lesson in Tactfulness

[Teryaani]

It's actually something a 50-something year old Japanese woman who is paid to teach Japanese language and culture taught me. I assume she knows what she is talking about. Bless his heart isn't really a Southern thing, it's common in the UK too. It can be affectionate or patronising depending on how it's used. Often both.

And my French professor in college was an elderly woman who grew up in the south of France. From her I heard all sorts of things about the French character which after meeting and working with actual French people turned out to be nothing more than a pile of stereotypes that applied to none of them. Her job as a language teacher is to get you interested in the language and culture and you will get a very rose colored glasses view of it.

[Aegis]

If you want to learn tact, read PG Wodehouse and memorise all the Jeeves lines, eg:

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Bertie Wooster: A cyclone is what happened next, Jeeves, emanating from this girl. She started on my own legs, saying that they weren't much to write home about, and then she moved on to dissect my manners, morals, intellect, general physique and method of eating asparagus. By the time she'd finished, the best that could be said about poor old Bertram was that, so far as was known, he hadn't actually burnt down an orphanage.
Jeeves: Most illuminating story, sir.
Bertie Wooster: No, no, no, no, no, Jeeves, Jeeves, you haven't heard the payoff yet!
Jeeves: Oh, I'm so sorry, sir! The structure of your tale deceived me for a moment into thinking that it was over.
Bertie Wooster: No, no, the point is that she was actually engaged to this fellow with the legs. They'd had some minor disagreement the night before, but there they were the following night, dining together, their differences made up and the love-light once more in their eyes. And I expect much the same results with my cousin Angela.
Jeeves: I look forward to it with lively anticipation, sir.

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And my French professor in college was an elderly woman who grew up in the south of France. From her I heard all sorts of things about the French character which after meeting and working with actual French people turned out to be nothing more than a pile of stereotypes that applied to none of them.

Up to them if they are annoyed or not...why shoudl I care of that frankly ? why ?

Mei

Some French live up to the stereotype more than others, for sure.

[Teryaani]

Some French live up to the stereotype more than others, for sure.

Uh, that wasn't one of the traits she talked about. My point in that is that people act pretty much the same everywhere and the mix of tactful and tactless seems pretty constant.

[Aegis]

Uh, that wasn't one of the traits she talked about. My point in that is that people act pretty much the same everywhere and the mix of tactful and tactless seems pretty constant.

Are you saying, then, that cultural differences in this area don't exist?

I'd agree that there is far more variation within cultures than between them, but there's huge bodies of evidence about behavioural differences between cultures.

[XNihili]

I wonder how many of those salty people are working with any social interaction or working at all.
When you need to get things done, being a foul mouth won't get yourself very far and at the end of the day, you get penalized even if it's not your fault.

[Teryaani]

Are you saying, then, that cultural differences in this area don't exist?

I'd agree that there is far more variation within cultures than between them, but there's huge bodies of evidence about behavioural differences between cultures.

I'm saying that the capacity for tact is the same regardless of where you come from.

[Aegis]

I'm saying that the capacity for tact is the same regardless of where you come from.

But not the prevalence

[Teryaani]

But not the prevalence

I disagree. You're trying to paint North America and Western Europe as some rude, rolling fist fight and Japan as some paragon of good manners. Neither of those things are true. The reality is much more gray.

[HakuroDK]

Gentlemen, please! Let's stay on task!

Cultural differences aren't relevant to this conversation as we are dealing with tact on the forums and in-game. As this section of the forums is in English, let us focus on tact as it pertains to the English speaking population for now. Cultural differences in how tact is handled, while a fascinating topic, should perhaps be relegated to another thread or a private conversation.

tact = form of hypocrisy....
Tact = form of lie

Tact = sending someone to hell giving him /her the impression to go to heaven.

Question : why on Earth should I try to place myself in the other person shoe before I say something ? why on Earth should I do that ? in saying someone needs to be tactfull you are saying that THEIR feeling are more important then mines. I am not responsible on how other people understand what I say, that is purely on them, if they decide to take it as being a hurtful mean,well no matter how I will say it it will be taken as hurtful..so best say it point blank at least it is clear and straight to the point..no misunderstandings or unspoken truth which make everything more difficult.

By having tact or in other words, being politically correct, you are just telling to people what they want to hear...rather then what you want them to hear. Kind of dumb.

Up to them if they are annoyed or not...why shoudl I care of that frankly ? why ?

Mei

I'll give you an example. I've been using tact in this entire thread and I can honestly say that I have not once lied to anyone, said something hypocritical, or "sent someone to hell" thus far. So... I don't believe you're right there.

Answer to your question: To be understanding of someone else is to know how to better deal with certain individuals in a way so that they don't see you as rude. I mean, if that is the way you wish to be perceived, then that is certainly your choice. However, as I mentioned earlier, every choice has a consequence. Everyone needs to be regarded as equally as important to yourself. If you see yourself as superior, then very few people will like you.

I mean, I could be tactless and say that "Your level of grammar is utter garbage, that makes you look like an idiot, and you need to go back to school." However, that's not fair of me to say because I don't know you. You could have a huge amount of circumstances pertaining to that subject which I could not know about nor ever know about and it would be insensitive of me to make any kind of assessment about your grammar level because of that. It would also be more tactful of me to ignore your grammar usage entirely as it is not relevant to the conversation.

The thing is, blunt truth is painful. Blunt truth is harsh. And it doesn't have to be that way in the slightest, because all that painful truth accomplishes is to cause people to feel as if you are attacking them. If you are attacking them, to them, you are a bad person who needs to be attacked back. That is what starts fights.

To say that tact is nothing but lies to cover up the truth is completely false and missing the point. Tact is a way of phrasing an otherwise harsh truth to make it not hurt so bad. It's not meant to twist the truth into a lie, it's meant to soften the blow of a harsh truth. The truth is still getting across, it just doesn't hurt so bad.

[Aegis]

I disagree. You're trying to paint North America and Western Europe as some rude, rolling fist fight and Japan as some paragon of good manners. Neither of those things are true. The reality is much more gray.

Whu? Wh.. What?

You're the one who accused someone of Nationalism (though I have no idea what Nation that player comes from, apparently you do and it's not Western) and racism against an entire hemisphere.

Not at all, I use UK/USA as the 'baseline' of tact as it's what I've grown up with. From this point I then assess whether someone is tactful or tactless based on that standard.

I am just stating that Japanese culture is one of politeness, conflict-avoidance and circumspection that results in tact. If someone asks you how you are in Japan, the only answer is 'Fine, thank you'. No other answer is acceptable because of the obligation it would put on someone else to care. If that's not tact, I don't know what is.