How is SMN overall dps?

[Sequora]

I use Ifrit in all of FCOB now.

I'm actually interested in trying this. I agree it kind of sucks having manage using things like raging strikes, X-pots, and poison pots with contagion. I do have a couple concerns. I'm a very avid aerial slash user. In t10 I use it during the adds phase to get a little extra DPS. Flaming crush range is 3y which is absolutely tiny. I don't even know if it would hit both adds when they're together. For T11 I'm the only caster. We have our BRD DoT up my add, but with a very skilled MNK and NIN in my group I think I would struggle to get down my add in a timely manner as the cube would take reduced damage from ifrit. For T11 I use aerial slash on black fires, and I use it during the bennu phase. Flaming crush probably wouldn't hit all the bennus. Suggestions?

[Tex_Mex]

So this is just me running some quick and dirty numbers. Using a 3 minute total time (since this is the CD of Raging Strikes) I was able to estimate the additional potency gained by Each pet.

For Ifrit:
in 3 minutes, Ifrit attacks 60 times for 120 potency each
Ifrit = 120*60 = 7200 potency

Garuda:
Garuda hits 19 times/min for 100 pot each (1 att/min is lost to contagion)
Garuda = 100*19*3 = 5700
Garuda also gets additional DPS for Contagion. 15 seconds of 20% increased DPS for DoT's = 112.5 potency per 3 minutes (350*(15/30)*.2)+(300*(15/24)*.2)+(240*(15/18)*.2) = 112.5. This number would be higher factoring in PPP and int pots, but only marginally. We will round up to 150 for estimation purposes.

Lastly, caster gets 3 extra ruins/min from Contagion, so 80*3*3 = 720 potency
All together Garuda = 5700+150+720 = 6570 potency

This is roughly 600 potency less than ifrit in 3 minutes. And that is without factoring enkindle, spur, and rouse which all help ifrit more than garuda.

[Tex_Mex]

Flaming crush range is 3y which is absolutely tiny. I don't even know if it would hit both adds when they're together. For T11 I'm the only caster. We have our BRD DoT up my add, but with a very skilled MNK and NIN in my group I think I would struggle to get down my add in a timely manner as the cube would take reduced damage from ifrit. Suggestions?

For T11, if you are the only magic user, then you probably need to use Garuda so that you can get the cube down in a timely manner. As for AoE, Garuda is usually stronger in AoE situations because Contagion+Bane is an extremely effective AoE DPS tool. Ifrits AoE damage is ok, but the short range on flaming crush leaves some to be desired.

Ifrits Enkindle hits harder than Garudas, but only by a measly 50 potency, and that's only if the enemies are alive for 15 seconds after the attack. So ya, if you are needing to provide higher AoE DPS, go garuda, but ifrit is the king for ST dps

[Judge_Xero]

I'm actually interested in trying this. I agree it kind of sucks having manage using things like raging strikes, X-pots, and poison pots with contagion. I do have a couple concerns. I'm a very avid aerial slash user. In t10 I use it during the adds phase to get a little extra DPS. Flaming crush range is 3y which is absolutely tiny. I don't even know if it would hit both adds when they're together. For T11 I'm the only caster. We have our BRD DoT up my add, but with a very skilled MNK and NIN in my group I think I would struggle to get down my add in a timely manner as the cube would take reduced damage from ifrit. For T11 I use aerial slash on black fires, and I use it during the bennu phase. Flaming crush probably wouldn't hit all the bennus. Suggestions?

In T10 the Brother/Sister are usually on top of each other when tanked together, so Flaming Crush will hit both. (you have to wait till they are in pos though)

T11 as SMN and the only caster you would probably have to use Garuda (placed in the center attacking the Cube) or like you said you will have issues killing the Cube in time.
That's why I would highly recommend trying to LVL 2 Caster LB both the Cube and Sphere to finish them off. (if using Ifrit on the Sphere)
The other option is to try it without Garuda but to stock pile a full set of Aetherflow for the add phase. Using up the set of Aether prior to the phase change will only push the phase slightly faster, but having 6 Aether Stacks to use right at the start of the add phase (used with Quelling or your tank will hate you) will burn that add down pretty fast, especially since you will have Raging Strikes up by then.
Either way I would only recommend using Ifrit on the Sphere if you chose to use it for T11.

T12 - yeah I was using Aerial Slash on Black fires as well, but it wasn't needed. As the only caster in your Group, I'd recommend having the SCH just Bane to the black fires and that will kill them, and the Bard can finish off any stragglers. That way you can focus purely on having your Dots ready to bane onto the Bennu, and doing as much single target DPS as you can.

(The other thing I'm playing with is Bio + M2 on the Bennu, into Ruin spam) The reason for this is because you can't time you dots exactly when a Bennu comes out without clipping them too soon, thus wasted resources. So without a guarantee that your Bane will cause 300 Potency or greater to the Bennu, resource wise it may be best to Bio and Miasma II, which are both almost guaranteed to run their duration. This leaves an additional 300 potency to drop on Phoenix + the 70 Potency from M2 on Phoenix. So essentially if your Bane will not do 370 Potency to the Bennu before it dies (12<seconds on all dots prior to Baning) then you will want to do the above. )

Since you will probably be on Bennu duty with your Bard (2X Melee should stay on the boss) You can probably get away with your Bard just tossing both their Dots on the Bennu while you Ruin it once it's headed to it's die area. (otherwise you risk an interrupted cast) This gives both your dots and the bards dots time to take a chunk off the bennu and gives you time to reapply any dots on the boss that may be coming off and/or to continue casting Ruin on the Boss. (Virus the Bennu whenever possible)

(In most cases Flaming Crush will hit the Phase 1 and 2 Bennus if Phoenix is Tanked in the center, which it should be to accommodate a SMN)

For the Bennu Phase, Aerial Slash isn't a huge gain, and yeah, Flaming Crush probably wont hit all the Bennus. But your bread and butter on that is Bane anyways.
Dot # 1 Bennu - Bane to the rest - Kill # 1 -> Move - Dot the Big Bennu -> Bane to the rest (rinse and repeat till all dead) - my groups Bard usually uses Ballad for this part so that the WHM can main heal while the SCH DPS's.
I only use Fester on a Big Bennu as long as I'll have a AF stack to spare.

[Riyos]

So, i played this game since D1, so that would be 1 year + few months, and i played summoner for almost 1 year. Everyone, and i repeat EVERYONE said that Garuda was better, and so i always used Garuda. And now, today, i read that ifrit is "much better", like...what the fuck?

[Tex_Mex]

So, i played this game since D1, so that would be 1 year + few months, and i played summoner for almost 1 year. Everyone, and i repeat EVERYONE said that Garuda was better, and so i always used Garuda. And now, today, i read that ifrit is "much better", like...what the fuck?

It is not so much that Ifrit is much better. Ifrit is better in some situations and Garuda is better in others. Ifrit is stronger in single target situations, and Garuda is better when you need magical damage from your pet or there is a lot of AoE.

Also, Ifrit was buffed at some point in the last 6 months. I can't remember the exact patch, but prior to that, Garuda was better almost all of the time I believe.

[Delta041]

All this Ifrit talk as got me wondering about using the thing. I'm still not sold on it for final coil though.

I've cleared 10 11 and done 12 up to last phase as Summoner
t10 is a nightmare for summoner. Constant DPS against multiple targets that can't be stacked and a lot of AoE that doesn't ignore the pet. I do this fight as a black mage now, too much of a headache.
t11 is actually pretty nice for Summoner. A movement heavy fight and mechanics that more or less don't hit the pet. I used to do add phase by switching to Ifrit but I find keeping Garuda out is easy enough (even on the egg node) and saves me MP and a swiftcast down the line.
t12 isn't too bad as a Summoner either, but I can't see Ifrit being too good here since it would have to chase down bennus during phase 1 and 2 where Garuda can simply be set in the middle of the room and hit everything with impunity.

[ShinryuReishiki]

T10, Spike Flail doesn't hit pets so it can always be safely behind. It will get hit by Crackle Hiss after charge, but this won't kill it; it will be fine before the next charge even without Sustain. For adds, just stick it on whatever is the last in kill priority to minimize movement.

T11, can just sit on the boss the entire time which is the best situation for Ifrit. Stick it on the sphere to help soak damage. Garuda is better if single caster, though.

T12, again, just leave it on the boss the entire time. No reason to have it chasing down Bennus. In Bennu phase, I just make sure it's staying in the clump of birds.

For what it's worth, world first T11 and world second T12 were with Ifrit-egi.

[Judge_Xero]

You wont want Ifrit chasing down Bennus. You want him on Phoenix, where the Blunt/Slashing debuffs are.

Even swapping to Bennus with Garuda I found that on occasion she would simply stop attacking. I believe it's due to getting hit by a White Fire while targeting another mob, the AI won't have her switch to Phoenix after the Bennu dies, because she is now looking for the thing that hit her, which doesn't exist. So then you have to Heel + Obey back on Phoenix or else there goes 30% of your DPS staring into space.

[ShaolinMike]

You wont want Ifrit chasing down Bennus. You want him on Phoenix, where the Blunt/Slashing debuffs are.

Even swapping to Bennus with Garuda I found that on occasion she would simply stop attacking. I believe it's due to getting hit by a White Fire while targeting another mob, the AI won't have her switch to Phoenix after the Bennu dies, because she is now looking for the thing that hit her, which doesn't exist. So then you have to Heel + Obey back on Phoenix or else there goes 30% of your DPS staring into space.

Stupid bird-woman.