Rejoice ninjas!

[DoctorPepper]

I find it amusing that coldbrand only has ninja to level 31 and Nalien hasn't even unlocked rogue unless he created a brand new character for the sole purpose of leveling ninja instead of using his character with multiple 50s.

Both of you should play the job at 50 before you cast judgement about how easy it is in my opinion. Sounds like bitter dragoons to me, just be patient, your buff is coming.

[Coldbrand]

I'm not even advocating a nerf to the job, I don't even really feel the need for a buff, and the job plays IDENTICALLY to what I'd predict after having read the abilities the night the patch came out. There wasn't really any room for surprise. I'll use Doton when there will be several enemies or one large enemy in place for a duration of time, katon for group burst, raiton when huton is up and suiton fuidama is taken care of. I'll gain ring of thorns with no complexity, and two disembowel rip offs. Oh and the two elements of life surge split into two different abilities, except it also resets my main cooldown. Doesn't really sound like anything new to be perfectly honest. If there's a WAR in the party I can even ignore keeping up the debuff which MNKs require a second MNK to achieve. Cool.

[Kaze3434]

I'm not even advocating a nerf to the job, I don't even really feel the need for a buff, and the job plays IDENTICALLY to what I'd predict after having read the abilities the night the patch came out. There wasn't really any room for surprise. I'll use Doton when there will be several enemies or one large enemy in place for a duration of time, katon for group burst, raiton when huton is up and suiton fuidama is taken care of. I'll gain ring of thorns with no complexity, and two disembowel rip offs. Oh and the two elements of life surge split into two different abilities, except it also resets my main cooldown. Doesn't really sound like anything new to be perfectly honest. If there's a WAR in the party I can even ignore keeping up the debuff which MNKs require a second MNK to achieve. Cool.

on a group i can see, but one? how is anyone thinking this is a good idea? raiton and suiton are the go to moves on a single target. doton you are losing dps. the heavy affect only works on things that heavy itself works on, so that cant be used as an excuse either. the only time suiton is used is when trick/sneak attack are ready to be used. kassatsu only ensures a crit, it doesnt have a gain life back. the only move a ninja has that does that is mug if you use a specific venom. as for the debuff for slashing, if there isnt a war ninja has to do it. if there is, its a bonus. its the same thing if there is a second monk.
its like you havent played ninja in end game.... oh wait.

[Coldbrand]

You are smart.mp3

I said the mechanic was split in to IE the drain went to mug and the crit went to kassatsu. Fuidama = Sneak attack/trick attack which you'd know if you'd played THF in XI. No part of my statement didn't acknowledgement NIN is responsible for their own debuff if WAR isn't there. That's why I said IF WAR is there. Doton does more over time if the target is kept over the ring. It's almost as if you have no reading comprehension skills and are being condescending. Oh wait.

[Kaze3434]

I said the mechanic was split in to IE the drain went to mug and the crit went to kassatsu. Fuidama = Sneak attack/trick attack which you'd know if you'd played THF in XI. No part of my statement didn't acknowledgement NIN is responsible for their own debuff if WAR isn't there. That's why I said IF WAR is there. Doton does more over time if the target is kept over the ring. It's almost as if you have no reading comprehension skills and are being condescending. Oh wait.

doton does 30 pot per tic. it last 24 seconds. just in case some might not know, dots tic on a 3 second global timer. that is 8 tics. 240 potency over that time. and that is somehow higher than raiton?
the drain going to mug would make sense if mugs pot was higher, but its low as hell.
as for the war debuff mnk debuff i used that to show it works both ways. dont have two monks? gotta kick and lose some dps. dont have a war? gotta slash and lose dps.

[Coldbrand]

Oh hey look my misunderstanding of tics made me wrong about one specific move, ok. Everything else I said was true however so as I'd said I know exactly how the job will play because it's overly simple, especially compared to its XI ancestor. Anyhow, the point of me coming into this thread was to simply explain some basics about game design in terms of player experience, and to contest the laughable notion that NIN is a more difficult job than the other two melee DPS, which it isn't. The only noticeably challenging part of NIN shouldn't even really exist which is that the sluggishness of mudra makes it so you need very strict button discipline so as to avoid lag causing a failure. That's really about it. The job's simply not especially high on the difficulty curve, and even memorizing the mudra wasn't what it was chalked up to be because several combinations are non-specific which not only makes it far easier but is also completely stupid from a lore perspective.