BLM nerfs much over the top?

[PotatoTree]

Swiftcast lowered the potency, but did nothing to effect what you specialize in, CC.

Any good BLM in pvp will tell you that swiftcast flare was once their bread and butter.

I switched to SMN in pvp now. It's way better than BLM after the switcast flare nerf.

[Tonkra]

Dragoon has the 20s slow btw, all the other physical dps get the 10s versions.

So many veteran players rejoiced with the nerf to CCs, they were so OP when PvP was first introduced, they use to be the determining factor of winning/losing. Healerscould be taken out of the game for 52s with sleep alone.

How would you feel about being taken out of the game for 1m 27s with CCs alone(sleep+bind)?

Summoner And Black Mage were quite literally the best comp in existence.

You complain about the CCs, but like others have already mentioned, all the other jobs' CCs have gotten nerfed.

Swiftcast lowered the potency, but did nothing to effect what you specialize in, CC.

CCs are still strong, they just have to be used logically now.

CC's arent strong at all right now.. the first effect grants a 15s sleep.. which most of the time is purified for 70% ... when you sleep right after its around 8-10 seconds which shouldnt called sleep in any ways.. thats almost the duration of a stun in other PVP MMorpgs.


I come from DAOC where CC was one of the essential strategic elemts of PVP. DAOC offers one of the best pvp systems out there..
in DAOC mezz (sleep) and roots had a duration of 30s up to 1 minute.
In contrast to the CC System in FFXIV when you get sleeped once in PVP and the effect wears off you will be granted an immunity timer of 1 minute against the specific Crowd Control type. so it was impossible to chain sleep someone.
I better would like to have a working Sleep instead of a gimped sleep that i have to cast about 2 times on an enemy for keep it lasting for 8 seconds.

There are three different types: root, mezz(Sleep) and snare (heavy effect).. so when you get sleeped once then you can be either rooted or snared.. if these effects end you will receive also an immunity effect for these.



additionally you had skills like "purge" which is the equivalent to "purify" in FFXIV... but on the contrary it was on a 5 min - 10 min timer. And skills like charge for melee dd's just like for Dragoon etc.


And in FFXIV you can get purified by healers as well. so there are many abillities against CC in this game already. And for me 8 seconds sleep isnt really much a big deal or even to call it "strong" or an "tactical" element.. its just enough to run out of range or to hit others for 2-3 hits.

Thats why we have these endless Battles at flags in Carteneau, when there are about 3 healers in a party that they almost overheal anything.. CC could be a method against this.. but i think 8-15 seconds.. especially when you have purify ready for most of the time.. is just a joke.
in DAOC there have been healers, tanks, damage dealers, speeders, buffers... and those who were responsible for CC... in FFXIV you cant say BLM's task is to CC... its more like "a moment of silence" ... because 8-15 s isnt much more than that.


And you say you could hold people for 52s in sleep before nerf? then i myself would think it would have been much better if they overworked the CC system like the DAOC system... which means that sleep is being effective just for one time in pvp : after that the enemy receives an immunity timer of 1 minute.


But the "balance" formula from SE seems so flat and stupid to me .. i mean.. honestly..:

- 50% effect sleep
- 50% snare etc.
- 50% damage swiftcast


is that really how you should balance classes?! "insert -50%" ???!

sorry i completely disagree.. at least a swiftcast nerf of around 25% damage would have changed very MUCH.
why should i cast now flare EVER in pvp? if it drains of ALL my MP and does as much damage as i would cast firega normally??



in DAOC there have been casters that could perform STRONG PBAEO dd spells, that could kill an enemy within 3-4 spells... nobody complained.. because casters should be glass canons, and they can be interrupted easily... thats called a trade off!

[Slib]

CC's arent strong at all right now..

I can't believe people can even say CC's aren't strong. They are insanely powerful. I've had fights where adder sent two groups to Manors at the start and we only had one, and thanks to the CC in my coordinated group that's all on teamspeak, we destroyed them.

The issue I face with CC in frontlines is the fact that people do not coordinate at all. You can sleep all you want, but some paladin thinks it's a great idea to circle of scorn everyone and wake them up, or the bards that spam their AOE. A lot of people who PvP like to pad the damage meters instead of focus firing one target while letting your black mage or white mage CC the others.

When I played wolves den, CC is the most important factor in the match in order to win. Hell, in frontlines I've gone with 2 people from my FC to take over a base against 6 + other people and we've won due to CCing healers.

There have also been plenty of times where I was CC'd and watched my group slowly get picked off and noone was purifying me or my other healer.

I don't take you as a serious PvPer if you think the CC in this game is not strong... 30 seconds was rediculous for sleep, 15 is still too strong IMO. It basically cancels out 6 actions from that target. 3 if it's a 50% DR'd sleep.

[Atreus]

I still really feel for BLM's especially with the Swiftcast nerf. Here's the bitter reality though, if the enemy has the time and resources to focus you, your team doesn't have enough healers. This is still a team game. And as Straigus said, you guys are still masters of CC. You can use it proactively with a coordinated team, or to slow a group from advancing, or to clutch save a healer being swarmed. That speaks more volumes than you give it credit for.

[Atreus]

ohi Momo (:

[PotatoTree]

The forums are bad for your health Atreus!

[Dimitrii]

The guy is making a case for allowing jobs the ability to completely nullify all actions opposing players can perform for 30 seconds up to as much as a minute or more lol. There is no point in even indulging him in discussions about it as the idea itself is that absurd.

[Tonkra]

The guy is making a case for allowing jobs the ability to completely nullify all actions opposing players can perform for 30 seconds up to as much as a minute or more lol. There is no point in even indulging him in discussions about it as the idea itself is that absurd.

Why is that absurd? in Dark Age of Camelot, AION, Lineage II etc. its quiet common.. thats what Crowd Control is supposed to be...

Additionally there are many skills against CC also.. such as purify, skills that grant DRG etc. immunity against CC for a period of time... etc.


i think you guys are just PVM players who have no idea of PVP games at all.


-> DAOC PVP

DAOC mezz

By the Way yoshi P. also played DAOC as he mentioned.. But my opinion stays... we have no CC System in FFXIV.. first sleep is purified mostly anyways. what stays is a sleep of 8s-10s duration (which is quickly over) which can either be broken by damage (FFXIV players do that all the time, because they are mostly bad pvp players) or by a healer who purifies them.
Purify is most of the time ready anyways because the cooldown is quiet short.

and i dislike the idea of being able to sleep targets 3 times anyways.. one time but therefore a longer duration (lets say at least 20-25 seconds) would have been much better... than sleeping the target for 8s- 3 s everytime.

and as i said thats not all. Flare became a completely senseless spell in PVP. Not enough that it drains off all your MP.. with swiftcast it does not more damage than a regular fire I skill.. or even lower. after that-> empty MP.


thats what i call "nerf it to death", when a skill (Flare) becomes completely irrelevant in PVP. every skill should be usable. This is how balancing should NOT look like.

[Eohi]

DAOC mezz

IDK maybe I'm crazy but I've had that happen in Slaughter more than once. It sounds like you're from back before games introduced fair play when everything was overpowered and the players were left to figure out balance. Games normally last 10 minutes at most and you're advocating having a single person able to take a team out for nearly a tenth of the match. Games aren't about overpowered fun any more, its more fair casual fun. But you can still do exactly what that video shows so IDK what you're asking for.

[Houston009]

Hardcast Flare. I get them off all the time.