Extend Classes into full Jobs?

[Akiza]

The problem SE has is the Jobs aren't that much specialized from the Class. Most MMORPGS allow players to specialize their classes take WoW every class has 3-4 different specializations while this game only has one. SE should either add 3-4 Job trees for each class or have Jobs with no Base Class.

[RiceisNice]

The problem SE has is the Jobs aren't that much specialized from the Class. Most MMORPGS allow players to specialize their classes take WoW every class has 3-4 different specializations while this game only has one. SE should either add 3-4 Job trees for each class or have Jobs with no Base Class.

And I think this is the problem here. WoW talent trees polarize the different specs eevn within the same role. Such as the three mages (Frost/arcane/fire) are all dps, but play radically different with different mechanics. Same with warriors (arms/fury) or Rogue (Assassination/Sublety/Combat) for dps or priest (Disc/Holy) for healing.

I think they can make it work, but they really need to come up with something that will change up how they can play or perform their role. This either requires the differentiation beginning as early as level 15-20, or have an incredibly polarizing job ability at level 30 (such as defiance or that ranger-turret example I gave eariler).

[dday3six]

The problem SE has is the Jobs aren't that much specialized from the Class. Most MMORPGS allow players to specialize their classes take WoW every class has 3-4 different specializations while this game only has one. SE should either add 3-4 Job trees for each class or have Jobs with no Base Class.

FFXIV has much greater causal leanings, then other MMOs and emphasizes equal representation among choices. Branching out might help varity, but it also creates alot 'filler' that rarely sees serious play. Unlike many other games were a player must start a new character to play a different role, in FFXIV they do not. Infact SE actively encourages players to try different classes due to the cross-class skill options.

[Akiza]

FFXIV has much greater causal leanings, then other MMOs and emphasizes equal representation among choices. Branching out might help varity, but it also creates alot 'filler' that rarely sees serious play. Unlike many other games were a player must start a new character to play a different role, in FFXIV they do not. Infact SE actively encourages players to try different classes due to the cross-class skill options.

In WoW every class specialization is viable because they function in a role and play radically different from each other with different mechanics. Players don't build their own class they just choose a tree to specialize in so it makes it easier to put in hybrid and support classes. In order to keep the class system SE has to either add polarity between the Classes or Jobs by further specializing the Job system and Classes or scrap the Class system and simply have Jobs.

[Deliciou5]

It is sad that SE was so worried that FFXIV:ARR wouldn't do so well....they tried to go out of their way to accommodate players that were already there. Therefore they didn't wipe everyone's character because they feared making people upset, which led to them keeping the same system for class/job.It also caused all those server issues when ARR launched since they did not plan on being a huge success.

It is no secret that the job/class system is extremely limiting, i just don't see classes playing that differently than they do now regardless of what jobs they introduce in the future.

If they add another job to whm...will it not be healer? If they add another job to maruader will it not just be the same basic abilities being used over and over again that MAR/warrior uses? Same with lancer, rogue, and basically any other class. Yeah jobs add some new stuff in but you end using the same combos and abilities from the base class more often than not.

That is why they chose to not add a base class to dark knight because they did not know how to add the class/job in without having to feel obligated expand upon it in the future by adding more jobs to it when it is probably in such a niche role to begin with.

[Bishop81]

That is why they chose to not add a base class to dark knight because they did not know how to add the class/job in without having to feel obligated expand upon it in the future by adding more jobs to it when it is probably in such a niche role to begin with.

I personally feel the whole class/job system is messy and inelegant - there is little consistency to it.

Yoshi-P doesn't even like the system and finds it cramps the adding of new Jobs - every new Job has been a new class as well ...

I hope they "fix up the system" sometime in the future.

[dday3six]

In WoW every class specialization is viable because they function in a role and play radically different from each other with different mechanics. Players don't build their own class they just choose a tree to specialize in so it makes it easier to put in hybrid and support classes. In order to keep the class system SE has to either add polarity between the Classes or Jobs by further specializing the Job system and Classes or scrap the Class system and simply have Jobs.

Viability is not serious play, I'm not even sure what your talking about either, because it is certainly not World of Warcraft.

The classes are jobs so what do you even mean, besides that you want Summoner split from Arcanist so it can be reworked? And you feel like scraping the class system, leaving only jobs would allow that to happen.

[RiceisNice]

...

All the specs in WoW (differences only when it comes to min/maxing) were feasible in performing their respective roles, at least it was after TBC.

The problem here is that the game treats job advancements as just that, an advancement. Not an actual class change or anything. A ninja is just a rogue with ninja skills in design. A DRG is a Lancer with DRG skills, etc etc. You have the matter of
>The job advancement being well representative of the job. Dragoons fit this perfectly since they get mostly jumps which is a standard for FF dragoons. Ninjas also fit this with the concept of ninjitsu and having different animations from their class (rogue).
>Then you have jobs that do a piss poor job of representing what they are. I feel bards and paladins fall into this; I just feel like an archer who knows how to sing (especially when you learn a song before getting bard...) than being an actual bard.

Aesthetics aside, all the jobs are playing identical to their class counterparts, provided they (trying) to perform the same role. A SCH will do the exact same thing as a SMN when trying to dps, because all of SMN's dps abilities come from being an ACN. You cant particularly say the same for the opposite (SMN doing the exact same thing as a SCH when trying to heal), because SCH's healing abilities come from the job advancement, on top of that they're usually forgoing their dps that they won't use their class abilities anyway.

Now let's try that with something like Rogue to either ninja or thief. They're both going to be dps, and the only way you can differentiate them is through job skills. A thief is still going to use the same class skills as ninja, which serves as the foundation for how the class plays. If you wanted them to play differently, the job advancement would have to overhaul the class skills, or job advancement giving them an entire set of new skills that would outweigh using the class ones.

In the end, I wouldn't mind branching job advancements that would fit different play styles (similar to the talent spec system in WoW), such as an Archer becoming Bard or Ranger, or if they hadn't mentioned dark knight being job only... Marauder being Warrior or dark knight. It's just that in the current design of the game, it really disallows for branching job advancements within the same class that allows for diversely different playstyle.