Dragoon, under the shadow of Ninja

[Empressia]

Wouldn't be anything wrong at all with going 3/2, they're supposed to be heavy armor and even a 4/2 wouldn't make them capable of tanking.

Orly? my drg can tank non magical hard hitting boss (t7) like 20s (esp if the nub pld dead and the scrub war didn't defiance + provoke)

[Alistaire]

Orly? my drg can tank non magical hard hitting boss (t7) like 20s (esp if the nub pld dead and the scrub war didn't defiance + provoke)

You say that like 20 seconds is significant. Go design a strat around it then.

[ColdestHeaven]

You say that like 20 seconds is significant. Go design a strat around it then.

Pretty much that. Dragoons can't tank as of now - and tanking is definitely not "standing there struggling to stay alive under bosses' autoattack before even any other threat is being taken into consideration (whatever weaponskill/instant attack)". Without positionals and Blood for Blood, we can't hold aggro for long. Without cures, we can't survive enough for a tank to be raised (with cures being shifted to him). Without cooldowns (Foresight and Keen Flurry ain't nearly enough and you know it) we don't have any kind of edge to survive important attacks. So their current physical defense is basically useless and only improves survivability in open world, nothing more.

[Kuwagami]

You say that like 20 seconds is significant. Go design a strat around it then.

20 seconds is the time to raise, buff and make a tank ready to take hate back. It IS significant as an off-tank role if the tanks are out.

They are talking about bosses with low magic damage on melee, such as T7. Another issue is that even though the window might be long enough, the mechanics of the fight would win out. Once the Dragoon has to turn around, and doesn't have Flash to maintain aggro while doing it, they are going to lose aggro.

that's an other problem. But in the case which they can hold hate for 20 seconds, that's significant. Of course a lot of stuff can happen in between, but still...

[dday3six]

20 seconds is the time to raise, buff and make a tank ready to take hate back. It IS significant as an off-tank role if the tanks are out.

They are talking about bosses with low magic damage on melee, such as T7. Another issue is that even though the window might be long enough, the mechanics of the fight would win out. Once the Dragoon has to turn around, and doesn't have Flash to maintain aggro while doing it, they are going to lose aggro.

[Vodomir]

They are talking about bosses with low magic damage on melee, such as T7. Another issue is that even though the window might be long enough, the mechanics of the fight would win out. Once the Dragoon has to turn around, and doesn't have Flash to maintain aggro while doing it, they are going to lose aggro.

I'm probably incorrect here, but isn't it that the other damage dealers also have to face the target to actually be able to hit it? So when the DRG turns around (and everyone else turns around, too, as otherwise they'd be petrified) and stops hitting the boss, everyone else also stops hitting the boss, so whom would he lose hate/aggro to?

[ColdestHeaven]

I'm probably incorrect here, but isn't it that the other damage dealers also have to face the target to actually be able to hit it? So when the DRG turns around (and everyone else turns around, too, as otherwise they'd be petrified) and stops hitting the boss, everyone else also stops hitting the boss, so whom would he lose hate/aggro to?

He meant that we gotta go to the flank and the rear of the boss for a couple of our abilities - and we can't do that if we have the aggro of the mob. -15% damage because of no Heavy Thrust and ~8-9% even less damage because of no Disembowel - not even mentioning the loss of Chaos Thrust. Also, you can't really expect dragoons to be top aggro after tanks, depending on how many shrieks they got and how good the other DPS are. Assuming everyone is on equal level, during battle, dragoons will lose aggro.

Also, for anyone suggesting that, good luck on being "off-tanks" during adds phase.

[Vodomir]

He meant that we gotta go to the flank and the rear of the boss for a couple of our abilities - and we can't do that if we have the aggro of the mob. -15% damage because of no Heavy Thrust and ~8-9% even less damage because of no Disembowel - not even mentioning the loss of Chaos Thrust. Also, you can't really expect dragoons to be top aggro after tanks, depending on how many shrieks they got and how good the other DPS are. Assuming everyone is on equal level, during battle, dragoons will lose aggro.

Also, for anyone suggesting that, good luck on being "off-tanks" during adds phase.

But he actually spoke of "mechanics of the fight" and neither HT nor ID qualify as fight mechanics and he also wrote "the Dragoon has to turn around" which isn't the same as going flank or rear (as you just never turn around while doing that, you'll want to keep facing the mob 100% of the time to keep your auto attacks connecting).

I'm not proposing any form of Dragoon tanking as in my eyes it's not viable. Of course we may hold an add in the Melusine fight long enough for the OT to be raised, but filling in as an emergency solution isn't what I'd seriously consider as tanking. Any serious tanking would have the Dragoon drop dead in a matter of seconds.