Looking for Tips when Dealing with Ninja Aggro

[PWilson]

Exactly. Tanks that let people die are bad. A dps that doesn't watch their agro bar is bad. Or at least their both not that good/considerate.

I've had DPS impatiently run forward and pull the next group of trash. Which I know the party can't handle.
If you do this to me, I will seriously go out of my way to avoid pulling aggro from you. Maybe the healer will spend time saving you. Maybe they won't. That's not my business. But if you wanna dive into it so eagerly, you can deal with the fallout. I used to try to save people who did this... I gave up. Screw 'em.

Seriously, nearly every time I run Qarn HM - and I'm not even i100 yet(i97) - some idiot DPS will go and pull all 3 of the last groups before the last boss. (2x groups of 2 knights, 1x golem). And I will either die, or lose aggro and let them die. And whether the party wipes is whether or not the healer stays focused and has the gear.
Pretty much every time I run it my DPS combo is NIN/BLM, to cause me maximum aggravation. I'm a PLD, we're not all that fantastic at holding trash aggro. I've had folks scream at me to "flash more" when I've already flashed so much I have to Riot Blade and get mana in order to do it again. And then they died.
Ooops.
Let me give them a /sad emote.

/ sorry, bit of a rant there

[roninoftagrm]

It's really frustrating when a ninja takes aggro and I provoke shield log and nothing happens. I then proceed to use FB>SB and have a tug of war until the add dies. I do use flash twice in each group encounter. Should I rotate my attacks to it hit each add while the group focuses on one target at a time?

if a ninja wont slow down, then dont bother, they're hasty lil bastards who dont respect your bigger than their's sharp thingy

my one tank run in a hest since 2.4 was ruined by a nin, he says flash more, while im runnin around flashing adds, he's glued to the boss instead of add jumping.

so ya, if a nin/any dps wont slow down, let em die, im not spamming flash and running out of mp for you

[Stihllodeing]

post#31

I get what you're saying. However, I think there's a big difference between letting someone die as opposed to watching them die as a result of their agro generation.

When dealing with an overzealous dps as a tank, we have to keep in mind we have another dps and a healer to worry about as well (4 mans are really my only experience so far). I'll try like hell to keep agro from a dps that prematurely attacks or doesn't watch their enmity bar, but I won't risk losing agro from an enemy that is #2 or even #3 as a result.

I finally got around to farming Sastasha last week for xp and almost had this problem when having the opportunity to play with my first Ninja (pretty cool class ) I have the necessary cross-class skills and gear required to function at that level (have been a crafter primarily thus far).

I gotta say, that ninja was creepin up that enmity list on every singe mob lol. I didn't examine them to see if they were sync'd or not, but I haven't seen anyone get so close to the top of the list so far in my limited experiences. What I did notice, was that ninja seemed to pause their attacks right before they were about to take agro, or were getting very close. It raised my blood pressure a little and made me question some of my rotation selections a cd management if I'm being honest.

When it was all said and done, everyone in the group said something along the lines of "good job!" "good group!". The ninja actually said, "Good job Stihl, didn't think you'd be able to keep agro. I've been getting agro ever since I started this class!" (or something to that effect). I then felt like I did a pretty good job and felt more confident in what I had done on that run.

Morale of the story is that everyone has a role to play, and mashing buttons at full speed is only a part of that role. We are symbiotic in this adventure.

[roninoftagrm]

ill respect them as well, as long as they hold back enough to not ruin a good time or force us into a different mindset

[Lemage]

If the ninja pulls the mobs thinking they're invincible, i just stand there. The healer will rip threat off of them trying to keep them alive, then ill just flash and get all the mobs on me while theyre running to the healer. Ninja's all wanna play fast from what ive seen "pull more" etc. But their dps hasn't been enough (from my experience) maybe i just get the bads? cause so far I'm hating ninjas more and more. As for the threat issue in general, I don't have one on my paladin or warrior... not sure if it might be a gear gap or just a low level instance maybe?

[Lemage]

if a ninja wont slow down, then dont bother, they're hasty lil bastards who dont respect your bigger than their's sharp thingy

my one tank run in a hest since 2.4 was ruined by a nin, he says flash more, while im runnin around flashing adds, he's glued to the boss instead of add jumping.

so ya, if a nin/any dps wont slow down, let em die, im not spamming flash and running out of mp for you

This. This sooo much.

[ZarethTolabain]

Hello, my tanky friends.

I'm a Ninja main (though hardly anywhere NEAR a top-tier). While I do try to manage my threat gen, I have on occasion allowed myself to get a wee bit stab-happy and stolen some aggro (usually on stuff I'm level-sync'd on...and I'm a fresh 50, so...only at ilvl 50 for now). At which point...I do the sensible thing...and stop hitting. Way I see it...its as much the tank's job to hold aggro as it is mine to not steal it while doing my best to kill the offending mob.

Plus...it takes a lot less for a healer to keep a tank vertical as opposed to me.

[Synestr]

if a ninja wont slow down, then dont bother, they're hasty lil bastards who dont respect your bigger than their's sharp thingy

my one tank run in a hest since 2.4 was ruined by a nin, he says flash more, while im runnin around flashing adds, he's glued to the boss instead of add jumping.

so ya, if a nin/any dps wont slow down, let em die, im not spamming flash and running out of mp for you

LOL. I like you. Funny ^.^ At times I see their threat meter pop up but just stick to your 101 and maintain your threat. I am getting NIN up there now, only 36 though, and I find myself at the #2 spot on aggro list often. I am not trying it is just happening. Being a tank though I know when to slow down on my NIN and how to control my threat. I also know what my NIN can and cannot take in terms of a beating. If the thing is half dead, I'll pull it and finish it off. I do start off with a disclaimer at the start of a duty, "if I yank it, I'll tank it" and just let the tank know don't fight to get it back, focus on the rest. I have a dodge and a second wind I can use to help myself out, pots help too ^.^

When I DO loose aggro to a NIN on my tank though, I usually just Voke > charged Halone > Flash and all is well again.

[MirielleLavandre]

I play PLD, BRD, and NIN. Paladin used to be my main, but I've since made it ninja. I can say that throughout leveling in dungeons, and especially now in expert roulettes, it is quite easy for a ninja, with the right rotation, to scale up the enmity pretty quickly, especially after Trick Attack and a critical Raiton. When I get in dungeons with tanks in or around i100, I usually always hold back on my rotation (ninja is i113 atm).

I think the core principle that many forget is that success in the dungeon is a team effort, and part of the dps responsibility is watching their aggro and, if need be, switching to a target that has not been engaged yet by you (that the tank already has built enmity on). Rotating trash mobs is as easily done as it is as a tank, there's no reason for a dps to take aggro unless they just don't know about the bars, or do it on purpose.

On bard and ninja both, in low level dungeons, taking hate is even easier, and so it is even more of responsibility to use all the tools SE has given to make the run go as smoothly as possible, including disengaging one mob to change to another when aggro level is too high.

[LunaHoshino]

I think the core principle that many forget is that success in the dungeon is a team effort, and part of the dps responsibility is watching their aggro and, if need be, switching to a target that has not been engaged yet by you (that the tank already has built enmity on). Rotating trash mobs is as easily done as it is as a tank, there's no reason for a dps to take aggro unless they just don't know about the bars, or do it on purpose.

Agreed with all of this. DRGs can also jump up the enmity table quite fast if they're doing full rotation, so I make it a point to always keep an eye on it to make sure I'm not getting up too high, especially in low-level dungeons where I will just peel things right off the tank without even trying if I don't watch it.

A DPS who doesn't watch their aggro is an inconsiderate DPS. The enmity table isn't just there for the benefit of the tank.