Lock out is to heavy handed

[Souljacker]

I honestly want to hear what this better system is.

The better system is as follows, tried and true by many successful MMO's loooooong before ARR was a gleam in YoshiP's eye.

Random queue is random. No "Ok I will queue for a random but here are my conditions", no checking a box to allow yourself into the "in progress" queue, you are just filtered into the dungeons as they open, period. No telling you how many bosses are killed or any hints of what the dungeon is - the Random Queue is truly a Random Queue. You want a full run? You queue the dungeon by itself.

There you go - there is the solution without any arbitrary penalties just because the design was originally flawed and SE refuses to admit it and would prefer to make everyone's life harder.

I just got done running a cutter's cry and queuing up was actually pretty stressful. My roommate knocked on my door and needed help with something, and I kept looking over my shoulder because I was scared to death to miss a queue. The time started at 15, dropped to 9 and then to 5. Can't even count on long DPS timers anymore because the accuracy is even more of a joke than other games (it popped at the 8 min mark, as an aside).

That's not the point. Who knows what would happen the next time I queued up? Cat emergency? Car accident outside (I live on a road at a dangerous curve and 10-15 people end up in the woods a year)? Urgent need for the restroom? It's not as far-fetched as you think for something to pull a person away from the queue more than once or twice.

It's just so... unnecessary when redesigning the queue to function like all other mmos would solve the original problem.

But by all means - let's just keep encouraging them to put in penalty after penalty.

[MomomiMomi]

My roommate knocked on my door and needed help with something, and I kept looking over my shoulder because I was scared to death to miss a queue.

Dat 30 min penalty.

[Souljacker]

When you have maybe an hour and a half to play, yea. Some of us had to grow up you know. It's not like it was when we were young and played XI 8+ hours a day.

No one should be punished just because a couple people exploited the system. Take away the ability to exploit from those people (by fixing the queue in the ways I outlined) - don't take it out on everyone else.

[MomomiMomi]

If you only have 90 minutes to play, then you shouldn't be getting three strikes. That's just ridiculous.

[Teryaani]

The better system is as follows, tried and true by many successful MMO's loooooong before ARR was a gleam in YoshiP's eye.Random queue is random. No "Ok I will queue for a random but here are my conditions", no checking a box to allow yourself into the "in progress" queue, you are just filtered into the dungeons as they open, period. No telling you how many bosses are killed or any hints of what the dungeon is - the Random Queue is truly a Random Queue. You want a full run? You queue the dungeon by itself.

There you go - there is the solution without any arbitrary penalties just because the design was originally flawed and SE refuses to admit it and would prefer to make everyone's life harder.

This leads to a follow up question. Will there be a "are you ready" check to enter at all? If yes, then you've solved nothing with this as that player could just idle off or drop at that point. If it just drops the character in, allow me to suggest an issue with your design.

Dropping a player into a queue without warning means that the group could be sitting for some time while said character's player is in the restroom. Leading to a votekick...oh wait, you can't votekick in the first x minutes. So leading to players to sit and wait, abandon the duty, or leave and themselves suck up a 30 minute penalty.

Meaning that you just forced three people to suffer rather than have one person have a single strike toward a thirty minute penalty.

Also, that would mean no crafting/gathering/leveling alts while waiting as that would be class you're dropped in as. Good luck carpenter! This works in WoW because you only have one class. It doesn't work here.

I just got done running a cutter's cry and queuing up was actually pretty stressful. My roommate knocked on my door and needed help with something, and I kept looking over my shoulder because I was scared to death to miss a queue. The time started at 15, dropped to 9 and then to 5. Can't even count on long DPS timers anymore because the accuracy is even more of a joke than other games (it popped at the 8 min mark, as an aside).

You're stressed out from queueing? I sense some hyperbole here. That or maybe you should strongly consider the amount of weight you put to this game. A game shouldn't bring high stress. If it does, then you should look into what's causing it.

Also, three strikes. If it's important and the queue just popped, suck up a single strike.

That's not the point. Who knows what would happen the next time I queued up? Cat emergency? Car accident outside (I live on a road at a dangerous curve and 10-15 people end up in the woods a year)? Urgent need for the restroom? It's not as far-fetched as you think for something to pull a person away from the queue more than once or twice.

You get two unpunished strikes. If your neighborhood is constantly having cats drive cars into trees or whatever, then maybe better insulated windows to block the noise? I get that you're attempting to imply that you rush out to help the accident victims that pile up outside your door, but I'm not buying that as a daily occurrence.

But by all means - let's just keep encouraging them to put in penalty after penalty.

By all means, characterize my arguments that way. You certainly don't like to discuss things without hyperbole and painting those that disagree with you with a broad brush. Why stop now?

When you have maybe an hour and a half to play, yea. Some of us had to grow up you know.

Okay, I have to ask, honestly, how are you getting three strikes in 90 minutes?

[Darkstride]

Personally I don't care whether the 30 minute penalty is imposed, but I do think the amount of excuses people have are ridiculous.

What if I have to go to the bathroom? What if there is an emergency? What if there is a car accident outside? What if I need a drink? What if I get a phone call? What if my roommate wants to talk to me? What if someone knocks on my door?

Some of these you can plan for accordingly, some you can't, but those you can't plan for shouldn't be regular occurences. If you're getting pulled away that often, why queue at all? You'll be afk'ing in the dungeon repeatedly anyway.

You get 3 withdrawals before being penalized. Are all of these things happening repeatedly every single day to the point that you are always getting locked out of Duty Finder?? I doubt it.

Yes, there are probably some cases where someone received the 30 min penalty due to unfotunate circumstances outside of their control. However, I think in most cases people just need to take responsibility for their own actions and stop playing victim.

[Giantbane]

If you only have 90 minutes to play, then you shouldn't be getting three strikes. That's just ridiculous.

Even when you're not likely to hit the limit, the threat of it sort of hangs over your head. It bothers some people more than others. Just the way some people work. Another reason I don't like this.

Personally I don't care whether the 30 minute penalty is imposed, but I do think the amount of excuses people have are ridiculous.

What if I have to go to the bathroom? What if there is an emergency? What if there is a car accident outside? What if I need a drink? What if I get a phone call? What if my roommate wants to talk to me? What if someone knocks on my door?

Some of these you can plan for accordingly, some you can't, but those you can't plan for shouldn't be regular occurences. If you're getting pulled away that often, why queue at all? You'll be afk'ing in the dungeon repeatedly anyway.

You get 3 withdrawals before being penalized. Are all of these things happening repeatedly every single day to the point that you are always getting locked out of Duty Finder?? I doubt it.

Yes, there are probably some cases where someone received the 30 min penalty due to unfotunate circumstances outside of their control. However, I think in most cases people just need to take responsibility for their own actions and stop playing victim.

For me it's the 1 time that I might get hit with it that it's going to bother me. Honestly, I'd rather sit through 100 extra withdraws that happen in sets of 1 or 2, than deal with the one time I inadvertently get hit by the penalty when I'm wanting to play. I believe there are better ways to deal with this than what we have that would both be a better solution to the problem and limit the incidental punishments for what I view to be minor infractions.

Oh, and the group punishment thing. There's just no good reason for that.

[Dwill]

When you have maybe an hour and a half to play, yea. Some of us had to grow up you know. It's not like it was when we were young and played XI 8+ hours a day.

No one should be punished just because a couple people exploited the system. Take away the ability to exploit from those people (by fixing the queue in the ways I outlined) - don't take it out on everyone else.

Yes, everybody that's a responsible adult only has a hour and a half to play, else you're just a young person playing 8+ day Do you guys actually have some sort of arguments or only Ad Hominems and hyperboles ?

And by the way, just how are you getting 3 strikes a day if you only have 90 minutes to play, unless you're excessively disorganized ?

[Nutz]

I think the new penalty has done a lot of good for queue times, however they could have done it a little bit better. The entire purpose, from what I understand, is to combat in progress fishing. Groups can't join in progress so there's no reason the penalty should apply to them (or at least not the stated reason for this feature). In fact, if it's to prevent in progress fishing they should have just tied it to the 'join in progress' button. If that button is lit then you can receive strikes and be subject to penalties. If it isn't lit then you can't accumulate strikes (but are still subject to any current penalties).

There you have it. The penalty is still exactly as effective as it is now while preventing most, if not all, collateral damage.

[Giantbane]

I think the new penalty has done a lot of good for queue times, however they could have done it a little bit better. The entire purpose, from what I understand, is to combat in progress fishing. Groups can't join in progress so there's no reason the penalty should apply to them (or at least not the stated reason for this feature). In fact, if it's to prevent in progress fishing they should have just tied it to the 'join in progress' button. If that button is lit then you can receive strikes and be subject to penalties. If it isn't lit then you can't accumulate strikes (but are still subject to any current penalties).

There you have it. The penalty is still exactly as effective as it is now while preventing most, if not all, collateral damage.

CT/ST/Frontlines were also a big problem. In progress for CT/ST was actually already diminished from CT's original release because the progress is obscured (only shows 0/1), however because you need 24 people to click "ready" all at once, the chances are reasonably high someone won't be ready. The REAL problem with this is that you can get 23 people to say "ready", one person times out and the match maker just throws everybody back into the head of the queue, with what looks like no effort to keep them together. Ideally, the match maker should just keep those 23 people together and look for one replacement, if a replacement can be found immediately, then don't even require those original 23 to say yes again. Just wait for the 1 person to accept. This will drastically reduce the instances where the you get a queue failure and removes the annoying need to keep clicking "ready" every time another person drops out.

At this point, since you're not relying on the penalty entirely to limit the re-queues, you can limit the current penalty to something more modest to just deal with queue spammers. IE: shorter reset window for the strikes (3 hours maybe) and a more modest penalty (15min ish).