Lock out is to heavy handed

[Dwill]

Snip

Baseless Ad Hominems, obvious bias toward one side of the situation (the one against Square Enix of course) and prevents further discussion by ignoring people instead of poiting the flaws in their arguments. Good job at destroying your own credibility!

[Teryaani]

Just some thoughts:

Let's separate the group issue and solo issue because that, completely legitimate, complaint differs from the "OOPS! I missed my queue again!" complaint. The group penalty issue is one that SE should fix - inflict the penalty on the person who withdraws.

The solo one? I'd rather they leave in.

[Alukah]

snip

Oh no no, just for the record I main DPS and did ST a lot before 2.4 hit, I'm not exactly lucky with rolls so it would take me some good runs to get drops, I did get affected by people spamming withdraw as much as the next guy, I took these screenshots shortly after 2.3 came out

http://i.imgur.com/EGMMKqS.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/5wGr8zj.jpg

And it became even worse once 2.38 came and ST started giving Newborn Star. I know very well both sides, I've been in the affected side more often than I've missed queues, but we cannot group those who miss queues with those people in the two screenshots I linked.

When I queue for something, the queue is ready and one person isn't pressing commence I don't get angry, I don't assume that person isn't pressing commence specifically to annoy me or the other party members and, over anything else, I don't expect that person to get punished for not pressing commence.

Whenever I thought about ways to stop people from doing what I linked in those two images I always thought about a really short penalty (like 5-6 minutes) just enough so if someone tries to fish for in progress runs it would take them longer to find a run in progress than to do a full run, but not too much so people who weren't trying to fish for in progress don't get locked out for too long.

When it was announced in the patch notes I again thought it would be a short lockout, not too long so people don't end up entering instances and going afk to be kicked, and not too short so it's can still prevent "in progress" fishing, but now what we got is a 30 minutes lockout that for some reason also affects half-premade parties (that can't even fish for runs in progress).

I'm not completely against the current system, I get to queue to ST with a max of one or two withdraws from folks who either weren't paying attention or were doing something else, but I'm not happy with all the "not intentionally griefing" people getting affected with this, I think the system still could use some polishing.

Ugh I ended up writing a wall of text, sorry lol

Uses ad homim attack, and prevents further discussion... This thread is over folks

The last time or second last time we were in the same thread I asked him to not talk to me, as when he posts he rarely addresses the topic and only posts to flame other people or to start off-topic arguments just for the sake of it, I didn't add him to my ignore list then, but I did it now to save myself some time with pointless arguments with someone who believes he's always right and everyone else must work heaps to prove him wrong. But enough of Dwill, our issues are irrelevant to this topic

[Teryaani]

When I queue for something, the queue is ready and one person isn't pressing commence I don't get angry, I don't assume that person isn't pressing commence specifically to annoy me or the other party members and, over anything else, I don't expect that person to get punished for not pressing commence.

I don't take the withdraw personally or assume that someone is doing this intentionally, but it is annoying to sit in queue have it pop and then sit again. I don't get as heated as some folks that main dps (I main BLM) though because I'm almost always queuing with a healer. For those having to sit for 40+ minutes, pop and withdraw can be maddening.

Whenever I thought about ways to stop people from doing what I linked in those two images I always thought about a really short penalty (like 5-6 minutes) just enough so if someone tries to fish for in progress runs it would take them longer to find a run in progress than to do a full run, but not too much so people who weren't trying to fish for in progress don't get locked out for too long.

We disagree on the penalty. I think the 5 minute penalty isn't going to adjust behavior. 15-30 though will. It seemed like a really good spot to put it as it put it on equal footing with an abandoned instance.

They need to fix the "party penalty" though. While I can imagine a dedicated group of trolls abusing it, coding toward the worst possible behavior seems extreme.

Ugh I ended up writing a wall of text, sorry lol

After hitting my post limit so many times, wall of text is all I do

[Khyra]

Pretty disappointing how harsh people in this thread are, but not surprising for FFXIV.

I've had a party member withdraw twice in a row, so now a single missed queue would penalize me. Despite (a) not being party leader and not having control over when we queue, and (b) not being the one to withdraw. But of course thats my fault for being in a group, or something... (group of 3, not full party, so we were hit by strikes).

I've never been locked out yet, so I'm not complaining on my own behalf, just disgusted by the general attitude here (the "if you don't like it you must be a griefer"), if not surprised.

[Teryaani]

Pretty disappointing how harsh people in this thread are, but not surprising for FFXIV.

Disagree = Toxic community.

This must be the forum meme.

I've had a party member withdraw twice in a row, so now a single missed queue would penalize me. Despite (a) not being party leader and not having control over when we queue, and (b) not being the one to withdraw. But of course thats my fault for being in a group, or something... (group of 3, not full party, so we were hit by strikes).

Yeah, they need to fix the party penalty.

I've never been locked out yet, so I'm not complaining on my own behalf, just disgusted by the general attitude here (the "if you don't like it you must be a griefer"), if not surprised.

I think you may be mischaracterizing the conversation. I've seen two, maybe three posts that suggest this. Most of what I'm seeing can be boiled down to "Pay more attention" or "Withdraw if you're stepping away". The latter seeming like good advice.

[RyuRoots]

Oh, I wouldn't say you're a griefer necessarily, though it has certainly cut down on that. I would just say "deal with it, and make sure your party actually is ready when you queue".

[Giantbane]

While I can imagine a dedicated group of trolls abusing it, coding toward the worst possible behavior seems extreme.

Thing is, they couldn't troll much if any more as a group than they could as X individual players coordinating outside of a group. So it's even useless in terms of that.

[Teryaani]

Thing is, they couldn't troll much if any more as a group than they could as X individual players coordinating outside of a group. So it's even useless in terms of that.

That's true. The only difference is that they would burn through the free withdraws faster, but the net effect would be the same.

[RyujinUzikin]

I'm a dps and I know it takes a while to que, which is why I don't que and sit to wait. I go do stuff around, otherwise the boredom will be overwhelming.

Do fates, do crafting, do gathering, whatever, just don't sit around and get bored and then get distracted with something else.