Can males get some diversity?

[kamikrazy]

I know this isn't going to be a popular subject, and I know I'm most definitely in the minority here, but I can't help but at least TRY to say something about this issue that's very prevalent in MMOs in general.

The female races in this game have a LOT of different body types that are extremely different. You have your classically beautiful elezen, your amazon roegaedyn, your athletic highlanders, your slender midlanders, your lean miqo'te, your petite au ri, on and on, they all just look so different, but one they do cover a range: you got female models that go sturdy muscular and huge all the way to slender frail and small.

Now males? All of them are Buff McHugelarge. There is no spectrum and there's no variety at all. They are all thick, muscular, and all of them look like warriors, even when they aren't. The only exception is of course lala but that's obvious.

I know SE has to fill its mysterious quota of offering a never-ending supply of macho manly men to the game, but smaller, lean, slender males are a staple in the very source material this game is based on. Its a very established form in japan and japanese culture, as well as in the west. There's no reason that it shouldn't exist in ANY FORM in this japanese game.

So the next time SE adds a new race, I sincerely hope with all my might that they give the guys some more options, because right now, they don't really have any. They can be Rocky Balboa, Ivan Drago, or Apollo Creed. They look different for sure, but all of them are sturdy, thick, muscular boxers.

And compared to the wide range of body types females have, its hugely one-sided. It reminds me a lot of how in some of the newer 3DS Pokemon games, female characters have objectively more customization options than male characters by a massive amount. Its lame. Please consider fixing. Thank you.

[SilverObi]

No midlander male can be called Buff McHugelarge with a straight face and the miqo'te males are lithe and... catlike. The body types are quite diverse between races but maybe you're actually asking for more body types per race? Like not all roegadyn have to be jolly giants but some can be more trim? In fact if you pay attention to most japanese male video game protagonists, they're mostly thin pretty boys (midlanders/male miqo'te) and the two very obviously buff male specimens are very much not the norm

Also it may be a Balmung bias since everyone wants to be The Ideal so you see more buff guys than slender? I don't hang out in the popular RP spots anymore so I wouldn't be in the know about trends anymore

[Enla]

I would have killed for them to follow through with the Xaela concept art, except to compensate for the buff women the men would be smaller and lithe. All that said though it would be nice if they gave us SWTOR like body shapes even if that will never happen.

[kamikrazy]

No midlander male can be called Buff McHugelarge with a straight face and the miqo'te males are lithe and... catlike. The body types are quite diverse between races but maybe you're actually asking for more body types per race? Like not all roegadyn have to be jolly giants but some can be more trim? In fact if you pay attention to most japanese male video game protagonists, they're mostly thin pretty boys (midlanders/male miqo'te) and the two very obviously buff male specimens are very much not the normAlso it may be a Balmung bias since everyone wants to be The Ideal so you see more buff guys than slender? I don't hang out in the popular RP spots anymore so I wouldn't be in the know about trends anymore

The Miqo'te men are not actually that lithe compared to highlanders or even short au ri. Even the "skinny" elezen males have massive carhood chests. The only difference in males between "slender" and "muscular" is just a muscle slider, and that just changes a texture. The actually BODY SHAPE doesn't change at all. There really are no slender, lean, or skinny guys. They are all meathouses. Look up a dozen younger male heroes from western movies or a dozen younger male characters from anime, and you'll easily be able to make the distinction. There's a smaller, more slender form and a larger, stronger form.

Men only have the larger, stronger form. The slender, smaller form is completely not present. I know its a pretty specific example, but its like Soren and Ike from Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn. We only have Old "Guts" Ike, we don't have Soren or even Young Ike (from Path of Radiance). Its all muscles, huge, thick, buff, huge. Even the "skinny" males look this way because they all have muscle sliders, so SE makes their body shapes based on 100% muscle slider.

I don't think they need to do a bunch of extra work, just put in as much effort on the males as they did the females. At least give us ONE new option. Female characters are swimming in options, and males don't even have 1.

Again to the Pokemon thing, female characters get skirts, shorts, pants, capris, tights, stockings, all kinds of stuff. You know what guys get? Shorts and pants. Sure they both have 30+ items, but when guys get 2 recolored models 30 different times and girls get 30+ items with way more models, its ostracizing.

[SilverObi]

Perhaps it's perspective then. I don't view midlanders, miqo'te, or elezen males are slabs of muscle even in their builds. All the diverse options you said female models have can easily be applied to their male counterparts but again maybe it's just how we view body shapes. You can tell the males apart from their silhouettes just like you can the females (though I'd personally argue female miqo'te, midlander, and au ra body types are too close together and only recognizable due to posing with the only difference being scale)

[princesst3a]

I understand where you’re coming from. I’ve always wanted the ability to create androgynous or even just lithe, effeminate-esque male characters in video games, and for the most part (ie. every create-a-character game I’ve ever played orz) this is never possible. XIV is no different in this department on that front - all males (save for lalas) are clearly masculine in shape (wide shoulders, thick limbs, hell, flat asses). Some races have “pretty-boy” face options but that only gets you so far. This is all especially strange when you consider how small and lithe Alphinaud is. I would love to have the option to create and play as a boy like him.

Despite that, I wouldn’t say all the males are as crazy large and buff as you’re making them out to be...yes, they have a very typical “hero” body shape, which I understand is your point, but midlander males have very little muscular definition unless the slider is pumped all the way up, and even then the muscles aren’t large, just defined. They’re certainly much more “Path of Radiance” Ike than you say (btw, kudos for mentioning Soren and Ike in the first place. Total FE babes <3). Also, I feel like you're kind of generalizing when you say that the female races have more variance between them...I don't think that's entirely true. Roegadyn males are far more different in body shape than other race males compared to their respective opposite gender counterparts. It sounds like you're equating "muscles" with "body shape" a bit too much, imo. If we were to get more variance in male races, females should get the same treatment.

Regardless, there are a lot of character creation options I wish this game had more of, and more variety in general between facial features and body options is definitely one of them, for males and females alike. Unfortunately, with the system the way it is, I don't see them retroactively changing this any time soon, if ever.

[kamikrazy]

I understand where you’re coming from. I’ve always wanted the ability to create androgynous or even just lithe, effeminate-esque male characters in video games, and for the most part (ie. every create-a-character game I’ve ever played orz) this is never possible. XIV is no different in this department on that front - all males (save for lalas) are clearly masculine in shape (wide shoulders, thick limbs, hell, flat asses). Some races have “pretty-boy” face options but that only gets you so far. This is all especially strange when you consider how small and lithe Alphinaud is. I would love to have the option to create and play as a boy like him.Despite that, I wouldn’t say all the males are as crazy large and buff as you’re making them out to be...yes, they have a very typical “hero” body shape, which I understand is your point, but midlander males have very little muscular definition unless the slider is pumped all the way up, and even then the muscles aren’t large, just defined. They’re certainly much more “Path of Radiance” Ike than you say (btw, kudos for mentioning Soren and Ike in the first place. Total FE babes <3). Also, I feel like you're kind of generalizing when you say that the female races have more variance between them...I don't think that's entirely true. Roegadyn males are far more different in body shape than other race males compared to their respective opposite gender counterparts. It sounds like you're equating "musculature" with "body shape" a bit too much, imo.

Regardless, there are a lot of character creation options I wish this game had more of, and more variety in general between facial features and body options is definitely one of them, for males and females alike. Unfortunately, with the system the way it is, I don't see them retroactively changing this any time soon, if ever.

I don't think anything needs to be changed, rather, they just need to add to it. The next race, just give them a subrace that's akin to how midlander/highlanders are. That'd be enough. I think it'd make SE immediately realize that these types of characters are extremely popular (as you pointed out Alphy, who for some reason completely slipped my mind, but indeed it is proven true within the very same game) and in the future if they ever decide to add more subraces to the existing races, they could add more options under that belt at the same time.

Nothing needs to be changed, just make the next batch different is all, or at least make part of it different. There's no reason not too. Having more options is not a bad thing.

[KageTokage]

TBH, the one of main reasons i'm playing a female Au Ra is because I've always been a bigger fan of younger, lithe male protagonists like Zidane over the mature, masculine ones, and since none of the male races offered that option, I felt a petite, tomboyish-looking female was the next best thing.

Lalafells were probably the closest thing, but they're too short for my taste.

[princesst3a]

I don't think anything needs to be changed, rather, they just need to add to it. The next race, just give them a subrace that's akin to how midlander/highlanders are. That'd be enough. I think it'd make SE immediately realize that these types of characters are extremely popular (as you pointed out Alphy, who for some reason completely slipped my mind, but indeed it is proven true within the very same game) and in the future if they ever decide to add more subraces to the existing races, they could add more options under that belt at the same time.

Nothing needs to be changed, just make the next batch different is all, or at least make part of it different. There's no reason not too. Having more options is not a bad thing.

Ah, good point, for some reason I hadn't been thinking of the possibility of what a new race could bring as I was replying lol. That's definitely a fair option.

A lot of people seem to be pining for/expecting Viera to be the next race, and I've seen many of those same people hoping that the gender size difference is the opposite of what they gave us with the Au'Ra, so maybe we'll get lucky! I'd totes run with a lithe rabbit-boy

[kamikrazy]

Ah, good point, for some reason I hadn't been thinking of the possibility of what a new race could bring as I was replying lol. That's definitely a fair option.

A lot of people seem to be pining for/expecting Viera to be the next race, and I've seen many of those same people hoping that the gender size difference is the opposite of what they gave us with the Au'Ra, so maybe we'll get lucky! I'd totes run with a lithe rabbit-boy

SE has shown concept art of Viera males already, and they are exactly NOT anything different from what we already have in spades. They are enormous beefcakes just like all the other males. It might be more realistic to expect them to add it as a subrace option for an existing race. And the chances of them doing that are basically nil. So at this point it seems pretty hopeless.