Break the Trinity System Please

[Toodles]

^SE wouldn't be dumb enough to require such a thing... there are legitimate ways to balance a more 'supportive' type without making it mandatory, or at least any more "mandatory" than any of the current DPS Jobs.

Every class has its niche (or should), it wouldn't be any different with more Bard-alikes if implemented properly.

[ReplicaX]

^SE wouldn't be dumb enough to require such a thing...

The community is if it will take the path of least resistance.

[Duelle]

I am against the addition of a new support role, primarily because it adds unneeded complexity to. I don't disagree with more dps/support roles, as I suspect we'l see more of that. However, I think a better solution is to strengthen the existing design of spreading buffs, debuffs, and CC around ALL classes, and building encounters that aren't movement based DPS races.

Asking for more utility spread throughout the jobs isn't the same as asking for hybrids, though. "Pure DPS" utility usually comes in the form of damage buffs to the raid or CC, whereas hybrids usually get something connected to one of their other roles. A NIN increases the slashing damage on target, whereas a RDM may have situational offheals reliant on procs or the ability to reduce damage taken by one party member.

While I'm not opposed to this, it should be noted the developers have stayed away from anything that directly affects raid DPS for the most part. NIN is pretty much the first job that can directly affect raid DPS by increasing damage the mob takes by 10% (it lasts 10 seconds and requires Hide/Suiton, but still).

Every class has its niche (or should)

Mechanically, sure. Role-wise, not necessary.

All gaming communities in MMORPGs take the path of least resistance.

Fixed. This is the reality of things, and should always be kept in mind.

[Dwill]

^SE wouldn't be dumb enough to require such a thing... there are legitimate ways to balance a more 'supportive' type without making it mandatory, or at least any more "mandatory" than any of the current DPS Jobs.

Every class has its niche (or should), it wouldn't be any different with more Bard-alikes if implemented properly.

Except that if it's too complicated to obtain the same result, which would be needed to not make them mandatory, the class would lose a lot of appeal. If the history of gaming has thought us one thing, it's that communities gravitate toward the path of least resistance.

[ScoTheHunter]

Vindictus.
Best MMO combat hands down. No Trinity. Minor support in various forms.

GW2
Great combat. No Trinity. Supppppppppport all day.

The Trinity may well have been a player invention but it's the static game development that keeps it alive and necessary.

[Mirron]

Vindictus and GW2 both are games where there really didn't feel like much teamwork. Being in a party as opposed to being alone just feels like killing things faster. So I really don't agree with that. There might be some instances where there is "support", but it wouldn't really be any different from XIV in that case, and it comes at the cost of actually feeling like a group that needs to work together to survive.

[ScoTheHunter]

GW2 was the epitome of what it meant to be "in a party". Teamwork had to be coordinated. The difference between a group working together and a group of willy-nilly adventurers was night and day. People didn't just have skills that set them into a role that they filled regardless of how well or bad they played. In FF14 your standard "party" consists of a Tank, Healer, and 2 DPS. Its extremely static and the only sense of a being in "party" is found in simply filling the necessary roles. In GW2 your party consisted of adventurers who all support each other in different ways and how you either took advantage of each person's strength's or didn't made all the difference. One game's "party" is a static determined for you; You're either out or in. The other's "party" is a coordinated effort whose output is determined not by what you are, but what you do.

[ScoTheHunter]

Vindictus takes a very different approach to combat that makes it extremely fast paced and unique. It's combat is not about using skills as much as it is about having skill. A "party" in Vindictus was (as you said) there to kill something faster and help overcome mechanics that required teamwork. That doesn't make it a bad thing. In doing this they showed that a game doesn't have to have a static, role dependent, limiting factor but instead be designed in such a way that allowed many different styles of play to come together and kick butt. No, it's not perfect, but I've never played a game where what or how I chose to play meant nothing more than how much fun I had. That's how it should be. It still has several elements of support/teamwork built into the fights/environments themselves rather than into the specific character designs. That's why Vindictus is a great team game. Not for it's static, pre-designated class teamwork, but for it's freedom and enjoyment.

[Sheele]

True Support Jobs would serve this game so well.

Bard, Dancer, Time Mage, mmm.

The premise behind a True Support is just exciting.

What do you all think?

No... My single biggest error in XI, the game you are referencing! I leveled up BRD... take a wild guess if I ever was allowed to bring another job to end game.
Guess.. come on...
No i was not, even though I had majority pf the jobs caped in and late end game armor, I was never given to chance to play another job again.
Reason, BRD was the important support role, that NO ONE wanted to play, but EVERYONE wanted in the party.
What I would rather have SE make happen in the future is, spread all the support abilities on to existing and new jobs.
But keep that support role out of here. Content that matters is 8 person, if all 8 have support abilities that is enough imho.

[LeCard]

While I'm not opposed to this, it should be noted the developers have stayed away from anything that directly affects raid DPS for the most part. NIN is pretty much the first job that can directly affect raid DPS by increasing damage the mob takes by 10% (it lasts 10 seconds and requires Hide/Suiton, but still).

You forgot Bard, most do. If there is a BLM/SMN in your party a Bard can directly affect DPS by using Foe Requiem ballad for, I think, 10% boost to dmg taken by mobs from magic damage. It could also be used to increase a healer's DPS if you really wanted to, but that could get questionable and/or risky depending on how much healing they need to be doing.