Devs: A Monk front-facing combo. (Positional Requirement)

[Joeymtl]

That would cause every MNKs to try to land those combos even in party raids for the crit decrease, risking getting hit by every cleaves. I'm sure all healers will love this. No thanks.

You can do all your positional requirements when soloing, it just requires more timing to move right before the cooldown for your next ability ends.

[Akamu_Aniketos]

That would cause every MNKs to try to land those combos even in party raids for the crit decrease, risking getting hit by every cleaves. I'm sure all healers will love this. No thanks.

...For real?

[Akamu_Aniketos]

(and i don't see how people can say this community is amazing when i see how people reply on forums. damn.)

I don't know where you heard that from. I see a lot of jumping to quick conclusions without understanding the perspective of the topic. But on the other hand, there are some decent people on here who actually have something to add towards the topic.


I play Monk 90% of the time, I always come across a situation where a mob will be facing me and it's unavoidable. No amount of split second jumping from the back to sides is even considered a reasonable way to deal with a mob facing you.

This is NOT just for running out into the open world and solo'n a weak mob, this is for:
-Boss adds.
-Bosses with no flank or back to attack.
-Emergencies when I need to kill a monster that is facing me before I am killed.
-Playing with a bad tank, keeping a mob looking at me so that it doesn't turn back to the healer.
-Playing with a bad tank that either moves the mob too much or doesn't position it correctly leaving me to get hit by aoes.
-Keeping hate on a mob to stay off the healer while they revive the tank.
-PVP, because who is going to stand there and let you hit them from your strongest positions.

You get the point.


If they removed the positional requirements all together that would make me happy. But since this isn't a perfect world, all I am wanting is to have a combo option to use from the front, from the skills we already have, without a 40% DPS drop off.

I'm not ok with mediocrity from a game that I pay monthly. I want this game to be fun for me, so I voice my concerns about the class that keeps me logging on.

[Spartan117]

As a T9 monk going on to T10, let me educate you through all your points.

-Boss adds.
Not your business, that's what OT is for. In any case you need to tank a bee in T6 or T9 golem, hit your directionals early when the mob spawns, once it gets going you'll never lose aggro to any class, a slight indicator that the DPS loss from frontal attack may be insignificant in the short run.

-Bosses with no flank or back to attack.
No idea what you are talking about here cause in my whole life I have never encountered such an enemy in FFXIV:ARR. If you are talking about Leviathan, the tail is the back and the side of the tail is the flank. Read up more.

-Emergencies when I need to kill a monster that is facing me before I am killed.
Why are you in such a position in the first place? You're meant to be a damage dealer while minimizing damage taken so that the healer does not need to peel his attention off the main tank. Is it because you tried to bite more than you can chew?

-Playing with a bad tank, keeping a mob looking at me so that it doesn't turn back to the healer.
Bad tank doesn't mean monk skills bad. Flawed logic. It's not meant to be played that way. You might as well give every class tanking abilities, healing abilities and dps abilities so every becomes a hybrid in each class JUST IN CASE SOMEONE IN YOUR PARTY SUCKS.

-Playing with a bad tank that either moves the mob too much or doesn't position it correctly leaving me to get hit by aoes.
Same as above. Flawed logic. Bad tank != Monk skills suck

-Keeping hate on a mob to stay off the healer while they revive the tank.
Same as above. Flawed logic. Bad tank or maybe even the healer != Monk skills suck

-PVP, because who is going to stand there and let you hit them from your strongest positions.
Because PVP is all about stun locks, priority target and positional dodging. Monk's best asset in PVP is to pin point the priority target (usually SMN or healers), shoulder charge in, one ilm punch, steel peak, silence. Of course there's mechanics that counter this, PVP is like scissors paper stone literally. It boils down to how to cheat out your target's scissors before going in with paper for his stone.

I believe 99.99% of the community believe that the game which you think is mediocre is actually damn freaking awesome, and I personally take that most of the points you have raised about monk as an insult because of your lack of understanding. Most of us actually are not too bothered by positionals at all and are pretty much happy to stay out of harms way and hit bosses from the back and yet still top DPS charts like nobody's business because we bother to train and get used to the game mechanics. So really, the advice is to quit whining and bring out the best in the class in the way it's meant to be played.

[Akamu_Aniketos]

As a T9 monk going on to T10, let me educate you through all your points.

Your opinions are mainly towards coil, I played up to T4 last year and my interest in coil is not there, so I don't even bother playing it unless someone needs help and I happen to be able to help.

-Boss adds.
Not your business, that's what OT is for. In any case you need to tank a bee in T6 or T9 golem, hit your directionals early when the mob spawns, once it gets going you'll never lose aggro to any class, a slight indicator that the DPS loss from frontal attack may be insignificant in the short run.

I'm not a coil player. You don't have an off tank in all cases.

-Bosses with no flank or back to attack.
No idea what you are talking about here cause in my whole life I have never encountered such an enemy in FFXIV:ARR. If you are talking about Leviathan, the tail is the back and the side of the tail is the flank. Read up more.

Demon Wall.

-Emergencies when I need to kill a monster that is facing me before I am killed.
Why are you in such a position in the first place? You're meant to be a damage dealer while minimizing damage taken so that the healer does not need to peel his attention off the main tank. Is it because you tried to bite more than you can chew?

The tank could have died, I'm one of the last alive; I'm sure you could have answered that yourself.

-Playing with a bad tank, keeping a mob looking at me so that it doesn't turn back to the healer.
Bad tank doesn't mean monk skills bad. Flawed logic. It's not meant to be played that way. You might as well give every class tanking abilities, healing abilities and dps abilities so every becomes a hybrid in each class JUST IN CASE SOMEONE IN YOUR PARTY SUCKS.

Never said Monk skills were bad, not sure what dimension that logic came from. And I'm not asking for new abilities, but the taunt skill from 1.0 would help in this particular case.

-Playing with a bad tank that either moves the mob too much or doesn't position it correctly leaving me to get hit by aoes.
Same as above. Flawed logic. Bad tank != Monk skills suck

Again, nothing wrong with the skills them-self, it's just the positioning aspect that I heavily question.

I believe 99.99% of the community believe that the game which you think is mediocre is actually damn freaking awesome, and I personally take that most of the points you have raised about monk as an insult because of your lack of understanding. Most of us actually are not too bothered by positionals at all and are pretty much happy to stay out of harms way and hit bosses from the back and yet still top DPS charts like nobody's business because we bother to train and get used to the game mechanics. So really, the advice is to quit whining and bring out the best in the class in the way it's meant to be played.

I never said the entire game is medicore. You're taking something specific that I am talking about and twisting it to mean everything.

If you choose to take what I say as an insult, it's because you choose to ignore my point and not understand my perspective.

"Most of us actually are not too bothered" So it bothers you and other people to a degree, but you accept it. I am different, I choose not to be ok with it so I will voice my point until there is a response from a dev/rep.

I've been playing Monk religiously since 1.0, all this talk about not understanding the mechanics, training, and trying to educate me on how to play is way off my point.

All I want is a combo option from the front that isn't as powerful as your normal options. It's not game breaking, and it would be simple to implement.

[Tex_Mex]

So I thought that for all enemies that you could not get around to the back of (Demon Wall, Leviathan, Tentacles from Hullbreaker Isle final boss) that all positioning requirements were not considered. I have been able to use heavy thrust (flank) and impulse drive (rear) from the front of these enemies and still got all of the damage and secondary effects from these skills. It doesnt look like you should, but I have never had a problem with this in the past.

[Tex_Mex]

As far as wanting a front facing combo, it likely won't ever happen because adding abilities to a game takes a ton of dev time. What you should probably ask for is just the "off position" damage potencies to be increased by 10-20 potency for all attacks that have positioning requirements (except the one that auto crits since that would not work). So instead of (Snap punch-Delivers an attack with a potency of 140. 180 when delivers from a target's flank.), you would have (Snap punch-Delivers an attack with a potency of 160. 180 when delivers from a target's flank.)

Implementing that change would make you more effective from the front of an enemy, while also not incentivizing you to ever be in front of an enemy (where you should never, never be except in rare cases) The only downside to this is that it would likely be a little too strong of a pvp buff for monk, so it might have to stay the original potencies there. All other effects I can think of are negligible

[SpecialKK]

So I thought that for all enemies that you could not get around to the back of (Demon Wall, Leviathan, Tentacles from Hullbreaker Isle final boss) that all positioning requirements were not considered. I have been able to use heavy thrust (flank) and impulse drive (rear) from the front of these enemies and still got all of the damage and secondary effects from these skills. It doesnt look like you should, but I have never had a problem with this in the past.

It's been awhile since I played AK, but I do not recall Demon Wall giving Impulse Drive buff back in the days (but it allowed HT buff). However, certain mobs do allow "rear" attacks from the front. I think Leviathan's tail allows Impulse Drive, but not Leviathan itself. I did not try Tentacles from HI, but tried it on Kraken Arms and ID didn't work (but HT did).

[dragonfire8974]

Your opinions are mainly towards coil...

Monk doesn't need a change in its skills for the very situational scenarios you gave. We don't want mechanics that rely on someone not doing their job.

[Ricdeau]

So I thought that for all enemies that you could not get around to the back of (Demon Wall, Leviathan, Tentacles from Hullbreaker Isle final boss) that all positioning requirements were not considered. I have been able to use heavy thrust (flank) and impulse drive (rear) from the front of these enemies and still got all of the damage and secondary effects from these skills. It doesnt look like you should, but I have never had a problem with this in the past.

This is only true for a few enemies. The arms and tentacles from Hullbreaker, and orbs on the final boss in ST in particular bypass any positional requirements, but most all other instances do not such as Demon Wall and the actual Kraken head in Sastasha Hard. Leviathan's head has front and flank positioning and the tail has flank and rear positioning. You can tell if the enemy by passes the positioning requirements based on the target circle when the enemy is targeted. If it is a full circle with no indicator for front (arrow) and rear (piece cut out from the target circle) then positioning is bypassed, but if you see the arrow to indicate the front and the rear section cut out then position is considered.