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  1. #1
    Player
    Takeshi_Eiketsu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    174
    Character
    Takeshi Eiketsu
    World
    Maduin
    Main Class
    Pugilist Lv 90

    Red Mage - A DoM Tank Job?

    While it looks like we will be put on a further hold for the Red Mage class...I have been hoping that SE would do something new with Red Mage like making it a Disciple of Magic Tank class! Would put red mage up in the front lines and give a use to abilities like Enfire/Enice/etc and Blaze Spikes/Shock Spikes/etc. They already use a fencing/rapier sword and a shield. Just because they are a Mage, shouldnt mean they cant tank. So I am all for a Red Mage Tank! Any thoughts? Opinions?

  2. #2
    Player
    Toodles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    432
    Character
    Toodles Mcduff
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 50
    Heavensward: Let us Tank Together™

    Please Look Forward to It™
    (13)

  3. #3
    Player
    Xikeroth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    147
    Character
    Satheena Mistalle
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 70
    I don't think the current DoW/DoM split works for red mage at all since its technically SUPPOSED to be both according to past FFs. Its supposed to be a melee AND a mage. A mage with a sword and melee ability. Not just a magic user. I am against enspells and shock spells as they stand

    I wouldn't mind having the skills Lightning uses in FF13 on her ravager in their place though Elemental blade attacks maybe with debuffs on each one and buffs similar to bards. I would also rather it be more comparable to bard, just a front line version of it. Even though I was fully able to tank on RDM in FFXI. I realize this is a different game and spells like haste and refresh likely wont exist like they did in FFXI. (and putting haste in could hurt possibilities of Time Mage being implimented)

    I will however fully support if its a tank since red mage COULD use a wide verity of gear from cloth(WHM/BLM) to light(leather) to medium(Mail) and maybe have some ability to make its damage taken similar to that of a PLD(because lets face it rdm could use shields too and we only have one class that uses shields all the time)

    Also another thought before anyone says MND INT for magic stuff... they could do like they did for dps paladins in wow and give a melee trait(STR) a specific % conversion to MND and INT via class traits to help its mage-like skills be more potent while not harming its front line ability.
    (1)
    Last edited by Xikeroth; 10-27-2014 at 07:57 AM.

  4. #4
    Player
    PureEclipse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    255
    Character
    Kiranoa Eclipse
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 80
    Ashelia Dalmasca was considered a red mage under the "correct" build in ff12 according to their own ff wiki sources, she later changed in the ds version for revenant wings or whatever it was labeled as for the "sequel"

    It is how I indeed played her for the fact I hated vaan...

    my line up was ashe as tank/mage and had penelo and balthier for my 2 others....

    but yes red mage as far as I understand can tank just fine with certain skill allowances...


    dunno if they will allow it here...been waiting for musketeer for almost 4 years...
    (1)

  5. #5
    Player
    Kuwagami's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    4,330
    Character
    Kuwagami Tarynke
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 78
    Quote Originally Posted by Takeshi_Eiketsu View Post
    OP
    Wants so desperately RDM in the game that they would prefer it totally ripped of its spirit than not present in a game not made for it



    If there is a mage tank one day, look in the direction of rune fencer or templar. Mystic knight too. Not Red mage.

    Quote Originally Posted by PureEclipse View Post
    Ashelia Dalmasca was considered a red mage under the "correct" build in ff12 according to their own ff wiki sources
    Ashe is a way better samurai than RDM.... also, "correct build" ? Since when is there a correct build in a game where you can build your team as you like ?

    Quote Originally Posted by PureEclipse View Post
    been waiting for musketeer for almost 4 years...
    They already said musketeer won't come. It's a relic of the past, it's time to move on.

    just so you know, the gunner (Fan Fest in London, 007 shirt) has been hinted, and the healer in 3.0 has been hinted to come from Final Fantasy Tactics. A bet people made 6 month ago is going to become true : the gunner has high chances to be the chemist.


    @GalkaBikini
    If you think that the RDM is a mage with better melee power than the others, you're missing the entire point of the job. It's supposed to be the fighting mage by essence. Good at both melee and magic, with nukes in both domains (even though both will remain inferior compared to "true" jobs like DRG or BLM).
    (0)
    Last edited by Kuwagami; 10-27-2014 at 07:33 PM.

  6. #6
    Player
    GalkaBikini's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    267
    Character
    Promyvion Vahzl
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Alchemist Lv 64
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagami View Post
    @GalkaBikini
    If you think that the RDM is a mage with better melee power than the others, you're missing the entire point of the job. It's supposed to be the fighting mage by essence. Good at both melee and magic, with nukes in both domains (even though both will remain inferior compared to "true" jobs like DRG or BLM).
    No, it's supposed to be good at black and white magic, and mediocre with melee.
    (0)

  7. #7
    Player
    Kuwagami's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    4,330
    Character
    Kuwagami Tarynke
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 78
    Quote Originally Posted by GalkaBikini View Post
    mediocre with melee.
    in wich universe have you seen that ?


    (unless similar to equal stats means "good and mediocre" for you, in which case I can do nothing to make you understand why you're wrong)
    (1)

  8. #8
    Player
    GalkaBikini's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    267
    Character
    Promyvion Vahzl
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Alchemist Lv 64
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagami View Post
    in wich universe have you seen that ?
    http://youtu.be/SuWhSMUSHfA?t=38m1s --- Here's some SUPERB RDM melee in FF1.

    http://youtu.be/LEzSkgaL_qM?t=12m56s --- As much as I hate to use this example (Abyssea), just read the combat log for Fahros(RDM) and Triedge(WAR).
    WAR hits for 197.
    WAR hits for 224 (retaliation, and then for some derp reason uses Armor Break. Imagine what his best WS would've done?)
    RDM misses his mainhand swing and hits with his offhand for 93.
    RDM then misses both mainhand and offhands wings.
    WAR misses.
    RDM crits mainhand for 100, misses with offhand.
    WAR crits for FIVE HUNDRED AND EIGHTY SIX.
    RDM crits for 135 main, misses with offhand.
    WAR gets a double attack, misses the first and crits the second for 478.
    RDM then misses both swings.

    As I said, I hate this example since it's abyssea, there's atma, I don't know these people or what gear they are wearing (it's been a long time, that RDM obviously isn't wearing accuracy gear though), or what level they are, and the RDM isn't using enspell, this is an EXP PT and not end-game content, etc etc etc, but even in the Zilart and CoP eras, these numbers pretty much scale the same. The RDM is doing God awful melee, and the real melee is owning it up.

    Do I need to find a FF5 video too?
    (1)

  9. #9
    Player
    Duelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    3,965
    Character
    Duelle Urelle
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 80
    I'll simply say tanking is iconoclastic to the job.
    (1)
    * The sad thing is that FFXIV turned RDM into a turret, and people think that's what it's supposed to be. It's supposed to combine sword and magic into something more, not spend the bulk of gameplay spamming spells and jump into melee for only 3 GCDs before scurrying back to the back line like good little casters.
    * Design ideas:
    Red Mage - COMPLETE (https://tinyurl.com/y6tsbnjh), Chemist - Second Pass (https://tinyurl.com/ssuog88), Thief - First Pass (https://tinyurl.com/vdjpkoa), Rune Fencer - First Pass (https://tinyurl.com/y3fomdp2)

  10. #10
    Player
    jomoru's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    694
    Character
    Arete Sophoi
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 70
    I for one think Rdm as a tank would be an interesting option vs.. you know yet another heavy armor users.
    (1)

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