Thread: Remove the Class System in 3.0

Originally Posted by Mysteran

Your example brings up the big problem with it. Summoner and Scholar. I focused on Scholar before anything in 2.0, was my first 50. And you know what? I magically had a level 50 Summoner too that I just had to do a handful of quests to unlock.

I see that as an advantage, not a problem. It gives people flexibility and saves time. It also makes it easier to try a new role which might help generate new tanks or healers and keep people interested.

Make classes into seperate jobs. Revamp the skill sets.

While I can't find a quote on it, they have said that there is an inherent issue in adding jobs to existing classes. If we take DRK as an example, were it to come from MRD or PLD all the moves that currently generate enmity would have to be altered when equipping the DRK crystal. In addition, there is the limitation of weapons. If you want DRK to use a scythe, in the current system the only way to make that happen is to implement a new base class that uses scythes. This would leave DRK locked into using an axe or a sword. This pretty much means that splitting jobs from a base class won't happen again.

As to the Classes vs Jobs, it could be viable to keep them around assuming that the base stats given by the job crystal were simply redistributed to the base class. Then choosing to forgo the crystal would not hamper DPS/Health/Mana in such an overwhelming way. If there is no plan on doing so, then the only reason for Classes to exist is novelty. That being said, my FC has had a lot of fun using classes with cross class skills to do things that are well out of the ordinary. For example, using an Archer with Provoke and a few defensive cooldowns to tank Titan HM.

I feel that in the long run, the devs would be doing themselves a favor to scrap Classes as soon as possible in order to mainline development of new Jobs, but we will just have to wait and see.

Yeah they should toss away classes.

They can keep classes in terms of a Job name/Title of Skill. Just remove option to switch between class to job.

Archer->Ranger->Bard
Marauder->Executioner->Warrior
Rouge->Thief->Ninja
Lancer->Templar-> Dragoon
Thaumaturge->Necomancer-> Blackmage
Knight-> Deathbringer-> DarkKnight

Going from 1 to another just mainly means you went up another 20-30 levels.

Originally Posted by kyuven

Foe Req and Mage's Ballad aren't strictly needed. It's not like healers run out of MP in every fight, and in my experience if they ARE there's a wipe coming soon whether or not ballad is up.
Again things like t8 and Moggle Mog EX are the exception.

Sure, songs can be situational especially if you're overgeared for content but when it comes to progression bard songs are must. Mp ballad was great for progression in turn 7 since it allowed you to recover from multiple deaths. On turn 8 tp song is great for monk and drgs and mp ballad can be clutch sometimes depending on the situation. Smn's need it too at one point because they don't have infinite resources like blms. On turn 9 foe's requiem is a good way to get out of the heavensfall phase as quickly as possible especially before you outgear it.

Originally Posted by Airget

Heck look at WoW for example, how many times have they changed their systems, the way skill trees worked, the implementation of becoming stronger etc etc. MMOs are a very flexible design so what we see now can drastically change in 6 months. But like all things it takes time to produce it and because it takes time the devs have to consider is it better to just scrap ROG/NIN for what it is or release it now and make said changes come 3.0.

Yes it changed every x-pack. And everyone except for Metzen hates the current one. It's a sure sign that wow is indeed dying that they can't create a progression system (the very essence of MMORPGs) that survives for more than a year. I love the fealing of progressing from a simple lancer into an effin dragoon. Or from a lowly pugilist into a monk.

They talked about it. My guess is they will redo it in a way they can add jobs without the cross-class ability and attribute points stress.

To be honest, our current system is a horrible 1.0 remnant which should be removed.

actually the cross-class system has potential, but there is barely any freedom for it :/. I would like to see more flexibilty in cross class ability/trait selections, that would churn up things and make them more interesting for classes since they have more options to choose from then jobs! Everything is so underwhelming strict and unflexible ._.

obviously this only works if you let the classes also equip highend stuff gear

Originally Posted by Daragust

In addition, there is the limitation of weapons. If you want DRK to use a scythe, in the current system the only way to make that happen is to implement a new base class that uses scythes. This would leave DRK locked into using an axe or a sword

There's no reason at all that jobs/classes can't use different weapons. They're "Gladiator's Arms" not Gladiator's swords. Conjurers and Thaums both use 1 and 2-handed weapons. So you have Gladiator's Arm which is a scythe. It's also clearly possible to prevent a Paladin from holding a scythe in this case given Summoners can't use Scholar books. And as you see on Relic Weapons and Armor, it's possible to keep a straight gladiator from using a scythe too.

I feel that in the long run, the devs would be doing themselves a favor to scrap Classes as soon as possible in order to mainline development of new Jobs, but we will just have to wait and see.

Considering all jobs need a full set of skills how is is going to be any different? Calling a Thaumaturge a Black Mage from the beginning instead of level 30 does nothing to change anything. Everything has to still be there with or without the aspect of class. Keeping classes, at worst, they need to think of synergy to make it branch to two jobs.