Instant Win Button [Can we have it?]

[Kyri]

They don't catch up though because they were never forced to learn anything or improve. They just get stuck again and we have to have this debate over and over again. People who cannot clear T5 now would not be able to go and compete in Second Coil even if you got rid of T5 as a pre-requisite. And content is already nerfed overtime because everything in this game is vertical, just by getting new/higher iLvl you are already nerfing content indirectly.

I guess I'll just keep editing this post because I'd rather not hit the daily post cap again

See, you're implying that as soon as they make their difficulty adjustments that all of the players everywhere are just going to log in and find all the Second Coil gear mysteriously in their inventory and have access to the Final Coil already open to them. This is simply not the case. Also yes, they play catch up. We're in Final Coil, they're messing around in Second Coil catching up to the rest of us. See how that works?

I'm trying to help some friends of mine that never cleared Twintania to take it down so they can move on because they want to get to Second Coil. They don't go into the fight and Twintania just drops dead for no reason. They still have to handle the initial pull with the Scourges. They have to get through Conflag/Fireball phase. They still have to dodge Divebombs or risk being thrown into a wall that will instantly kill them. They still have to deal with the snakes and try to take them down before Aetherial Profusion. Still gotta dodge Twisters or die. Still gotta burn down the Dreadknights. Still gotta handle Hatch and Liquid Hell (although that phase was pretty darn easy even before any adjustments).

The fight is easier because the damage dealt to the tank between Death Sentence hits is largely inconsequential, as the tank's increased HP and the healers' increased cure potency trivialize most of it. DS/Plummet/Attack in quick succession can still be tricky, but for the most part there is less stress there. The DPS checks are much easier. When I cleared T5, we had to 4 stack Conflags. Any less and Fireball could kill people. Any more and the Conflag would blow up too quickly. Now, a 3 stack conflag is normal. Easy to take the hit and survive, easy to burn down the conflag before time runs out. In fact, sometimes the conflag dies too fast. We had a fireball target run in to the conflag like they were supposed to, but the conflag died before Twin used Fireball and wound up getting the two people who got broke out killed by it. After those first two phases, though... they still have to get around all the instant kill mechanics. It is still a learning process, just not quite as unforgiving of one. Plus, they can just "turn off" the Echo and wear nothing but i90 gear to get the true "T5 Experience" if they so desire.

At any rate, there is no "instant win button". If you're new to something like T5 and think you're just gonna waltz in and beat it without a fight because you have an Echo buff, Twintania will still destroy you without so much as a second thought. Similarly, I can't imagine that Second Coil is going to be instantly trivialized the moment they make their proposed adjustments.

[Miitan]

I'm trying to help some friends of mine that never cleared Twintania to take it down so they can move on because they want to get to Second Coil. They don't go into the fight and Twintania just drops dead for no reason. They still have to handle the initial pull with the Scourges. They have to get through Conflag/Fireball phase. They still have to dodge Divebombs or risk being thrown into a wall that will instantly kill them. They still have to deal with the snakes and try to take them down before Aetherial Profusion. Still gotta dodge Twisters or die. Still gotta burn down the Dreadknights. Still gotta handle Hatch and Liquid Hell (although that phase was pretty darn easy even before any adjustments).

Exactly, but some people still claim it's too hard and want it nerfed to the point where you could roll your face across the keyboard and win because they don't want to do any of that hard stuff like learning mechanics or making some friends.

[DeadRiser]

Exactly, but some people still claim it's too hard and want it nerfed to the point where you could roll your face across the keyboard and win because they don't want to do any of that hard stuff like learning mechanics or making some friends.

But... they aren't going to nerf it to the point where you can roll your face on the keyboard. Have the nerfed T5 to that point? No. What do you think they said on the live letter yesterday? They aren't going to make it that easy. People are still going to have to learn the fights...

[Dwill]

But... they aren't going to nerf it to the point where you can roll your face on the keyboard. Have the nerfed T5 to that point? No.

Actually, yes they did.

[Kyri]

Actually, yes they did.

Nah. Twintania still takes a fair degree of coordination to deal with the mechanics. The only thing easier about T5 is the DPS checks, and the tanks and healers have a little bit more cushion with HP and healing potency increased. That's about it.

You really can't just run into T5 and auto-win without having some knowledge of how the fight works, and I really wish people would stop implying (or flat-out stating) that you can.

[Dwill]

Nah. Twintania still takes a fair degree of coordination to deal with the mechanics. The only thing easier about T5 is the DPS checks, and the tanks and healers have a little bit more cushion with HP and healing potency increased. That's about it.

You really can't just run into T5 and auto-win without having some knowledge of how the fight works, and I really wish people would stop implying (or flat-out stating) that you can.

Nearly every encounter in the game demands some basic level of coordination, whether it's Titan HM, Ramuh EX,T5 or T8, etc. The two hardest part of this fight for people (Twisters and Divebombs) can easily be done by:

• Divebombs: See Green Blinker ? Move to the right side right away, wait ~2-3 seconds, reposition, rinse and repeat.

• Twisters: /focustarget Twintania. When you see her cast Twister, run around without backtracking and getting close to party members.

That's it. And yes, it can easily be done going in with just the basic knowledge of the encounter and clear it as easy as Leviathan HM. I brought my brother in there as a tank, told him the exact steps above and how to deal with snakes and not 15 minutes later, 1-shot.


The fight is easy. What's hard for people is not tunnel visioning.

[Lemuria]

Nearly every encounter in the game demands some basic level of coordination, whether it's Titan HM, Ramuh EX,T5 or T8, etc. The two hardest part of this fight for people (Twisters and Divebombs) can easily be done by

The fact that you listed HOW it should be done is a clear indication that it still requires a lot of forethought and good solid teamwork. It only takes one person screwing up to get the party wiped by a divebomb or a fireball. I daresay T5 has so many little things that can screw you over that it's a wonder anyone worked out the mechanics (especially for Twister... I mean, who came up with the idea of everywhere you'd previously walked becoming a death trap?).

Personally, I'm not a fan of instant kill mechanics in any MMO. They're mostly used as a cheap tactic to force a play-style rather than adding any real innovation to the fight. That's one thing that coil actually does right for the most part. There are a few insta-kills, but a few mistakes here and there can be survivable. That being said, it's not content that anyone can complete. It requires a lot of heavy coordination, which excludes most casual players and practically forces you to run a static.

[Kyri]

The fight is easy. What's hard for people is not tunnel visioning.

Not to be snarky, but you basically just said "as long as people can handle the easy mechanics, then the fight is easy!"

Well.. that's pretty much been true the whole time. It was never really Twintania just outright killing people that made T5 difficult. It was dealing with people that couldn't handle dive bombs, or twisters. That was always the biggest hurdle to clear. Once you could deal with them all, the fight was pretty routine.

[Alkimi]

But... they aren't going to nerf it to the point where you can roll your face on the keyboard. Have the nerfed T5 to that point? No. What do you think they said on the live letter yesterday? They aren't going to make it that easy. People are still going to have to learn the fights...

Learn the fights being the appropriate phrase. Original coil 1-4 you could faceroll with zero knowledge given enough gear and echo. Second coil (and Turn 5) are a lot different.