Booing when Coil2 Nerf was announced

[Mugiawara]

The last thing I can say is that if you have your way, and all the content in this game is watered down to a ridiculously low level, then this game is going to die, and hard. I'm out of this looney bin.

Are we playing the same game?
You seriously have not noticed any nerfs up to this point? They've already done it.
Also, this game is already watered down in a lot of ways, soooooooooo...
The only sad thing is, the only amount of difficulty in this game solely relies on
Coil and some EX Primals. That's all you got lol. They need more harder raids instead of
end-all be-all Coil.

Semi Off-topic: I like how you are acting crazy about this but when people were talking about
Housing all you did was laugh at us, well aha to you, just you.

With that I'll use JTribal's quote for you:

I'm gonna have to ask you to calm down please.

[PandaOnAcid]

If they water down everything in the game everyone's just going to get bored fast and quit faster. People are severely underestimating how strong the carrot-on-the-stick is.

[Catsby]

If they water down everything in the game everyone's just going to get bored fast and quit faster. People are severely underestimating how strong the carrot-on-the-stick is.

i blame ilevels and the lack of titles.

[Hyrist]

The game never died from Binding Coil adjustments.

The game will not die over Second Coil adjustments.

There is a lot of hot air and elitism going on here over something that was inevitable since ARR was conceived. It's going to happen. Make your peace with it. You do not have to see eye to eye with the developers on every issue in the game, even the ones you feel are close to your heart. You are welcome to weigh your subscription against it, but I highly doubt most people in this conversation will.


Rather than argue a futile absolute, I would highly recommend discussing an alternative, or a compromise, as many on this thread continually attempt, but end up being overlooked or insulted, for what is genuinely offered as a moderate viewpoint.

It is not the place of any player to dictate the standard of gameplay for another, beyond their personal one on one interactions and agreements in game. If that was the case, all but a few hundred players would have to quit, for being unable, or unwilling to put the level of dedication free companies such as Blue Garter have offered to it, as they would be the ones who would set the standard. (Ironically enough, I doubt they would put such high hurtles on the entirety of the playerbase for outdated content either. It seems only a minor subset of very outspoken players desire to bottle neck the majority, in spite of the sound of the crowd at Fanfest.)

The sole authority in that lies in the hands of the Developers, who listed the design philosophy regarding raids clearly before the game was even released. I personally find it disrespectful of the individuals to boo the developers who have followed the course they have laid out to appeal to more than just a narrow band of players with inferiority complexes centered around a video game. This game is as much their passion as it is yours, and it is in their vision to have the game be accessible to a wide variety of different playstyles and methods, regardless of whether or not you personally approve of them.

And if you cannot find it in yourself to respect that, I have to question your presence here as such betrays the very spirit in which this game was re-conceived.

Given that. I understand the desires to preserve the difficulty of specific instances and entice players to improve their overall skills as not to be a burden when reaching current content and participating with more dedicated players. There are alternatives that can be discussed and suggested that can meet both of these goals, without directly opposing the core game philosophy. I highly recommend individuals take that direction of conversation rather than continually belittling or insulting one another for playing differently.

It's far more likely that an alternative will be provided for those who wish to have a challenge than for the Developer to alienate the majority or even a large minority of their players by making older content more inaccessible by patching content they view to be to narrowly designed. So, why not actually be productive with this conversation rather than destructive? Choice is yours.

[Tsuwu]

Should I keep making memes for this thread, or is it buried yet?
I had a good idea for T8's.

[Atomnium]

Honestly just let this thread die, because so far it's become a gang of 5 or 6 people just thumbs up'ing eachothers posts, patting eachother on the back and ignoring any point made from the oposition.

And why should they care about us right? All we are to them are hardcore elitists that apparently love torturing ourselves by content that can only be completed by a super-human...

^ pretty much this, if only they had something else as an arguments than the typical /Irl-Card, /SoHard-Card, /ElitePlayersReJerks-card or even /IpayForThis-Card... There is actually some points (me, as a raider) where I could somehow agree, like a longer "enrage" limitation, it would sound acceptable to be good at game mechanics but not perfect as dps check maybe? (cause of stress or idk :P), it could lead to interesting discuss without the obvious anger they share to us... But nope : /whine

And on a side note, the booing really happened and Yoshida made a very surprised face because :

It kind of shows who the vocal minority are to me when the forums are littered with people whining about difficulty but when a fan gathering is held the true feelings are much more obvious.

Yep, yep, yep, wish I could had liked more than once this reply. So... Who re the real poisons over this community? The fans? Or the whiners? Whining on this forum is the reason why the Final Fantasy fans can't have more than 45 minutes of raid content the Tuesday :x. Shame on you.

[ReplicaX]

And on a side note, the booing really happened and Yoshida made a very surprised face because...

I really don't buy that. I feel he was surprised from the over-reaction as its been past practice and 7 months since it was released. It explains why both Yoshi and Mr. G had to take more time explaining they are going to evaluate 2nd Coil progression after Patch release before even implementing changes and see when to add Echo.

Both sides have whiners, assumptions, over-reaction, and poison the community. To think otherwise is turning a blind eye and this thread if anything is a perfect example of it all.


I have been neutral this whole time:
- I agree with the Dev Team taking the Middle Ground. (its 7 months old and will likely get a Savage mode like 1st Coil).
- I agree that raids like this take time to learn and are challenging, however once on farm status the only challenge is a RNG and an option to streamline strats even further as you have progressively gotten better gear and memorized all mechanics.

The only thing I can bash coil for was giving it Lore on the Calamity as it was the main cannon for the end of 1.0 and the start of the Realm Reborn storyline. I hope SE learns from it and just makes something completely side story and not so connected to the main cannon for the 3.0 Endgame Raid.

The last thing I can say is that if you have your way, and all the content in this game is watered down to a ridiculously low level, then this game is going to die, and hard.

A statement like this has nothing to do with hrs of gameplay, BiS, Hardcore, Casual, RL priorities, Raiders, Elitists, or who the "true loyal fans are".

You just over-react and have zero faith in the Dev Team. Yet here you are trying to defend their "original version" of Raid Content and praising its challenge. From day one the Dev Team has stated dated content will be evaluated and if need be adjusted. Savage was made to retain that challenge as you already got the rewards. This is the Middle Ground.

This thread is completely beaten to death now. Unlike some, I will actually leave it behind and end my contribution without an extreme over-reaction.

[MeiUshu]

@<Sessurea

Skilles come with trials and mistakes, once you have experienced all these, you become skilled why ? because you do know what to expect, someone that makes it at the first attempt ever is not skilled, was just lucky, to learn something, anything really, you need to do it over and over and over again once you have done it over and over and over again you acquire the knowledge, knowledge is power and in this game knowedge is skill. There is a BUT though, you may be the most skilled person in the world but there is one thing that you have no control over is how the other 7 people in your group are doing, they may be skilled, but in a bad day, they may be new, they may be slow, so really, you being skilled means sqwat if the rest is not. Equally, if you have 7 skilled and one unskilled, the unskilled will pass at the first attempt but he still be unskilled...

Nothing is hard once you know, but to know you need to fail simple as that
Just me though

Mei

[Gilraen]

I think the bigger point with 'nerfing' Turns 6-9 wasn't to make it easier but to entice the majority to give it a try. Before it's 'nerf' Turns 1-5 only saw a small portion of the game population giving it weekly runs. Afterwards the number of players trying it skyrocketed. This was mostly due to the minority practically keeping the inexperienced out through various unbecoming tactics, though it's difficulty can't be ignored. Twintania still presents a hurdle to many in the community despite the changes. With the lessening of Turns 6-9's difficulty I have no doubt we'll see another influx of players trying said content (assuming they can get past Twintania). How this is seen as a bad thing I don't understand.

[Tiggy]

This was mostly due to the minority practically keeping the inexperienced out through various unbecoming tactics,

There is nothing raiders can do about the level lock out each week. The game is designed in such a way to deliberately promote statics so that we can make efficient progress into the harder fights. This wasn't some devious tactic to shut people out. It's this kind of rhetoric that attempts to make raiders out to be some sort of elitist jerks even though we're just using the system as it's presented to us. Many of us would gladly help others if the system was unlocked, and it will be in 2.45.