[dev1033] Class name changes -> Specialization/Talent Trees Into Classic FF Classes

[Seikninkuru]

If you [Removed by Moderator according to the FINAL FANTASY XIV FORUM Guidelines.] realized that I have acknowledged that and responded with this question:


You will see what I mean. Go ahead. I'm waiting for that answer given your brief explanation.

Your tree system isn't what I have issue with it's the fact you cannot wrap your head around the weapons not being classes but merely the medium that you gain abilities through.

Why does a paladin have to be a class and not just a role I fulfill due to the coices in abilities and stats I make.

Instead of character uniqueness(which vanishes with the introduction of classes rather than barebones vehicles).

I understand your system, I disagree with it emphatically because I prefer to design a character and not level a class. Currently the game allows me to do that. I do not see in your system how it allows me to do that.

It's simply a job/sub job/advanced job system with talent trees(which isn't a BAD thing per se' just something I do not enjoy).

Sorry - to clarify further. Why should I have to unlock another job and then level that to gain specialization when i can just do that as is by mixing the skills giving to me(let's refer to classes as skills).

To clarify further - Why does there have to be some <insert class> here to get x ability anyway? Why not just have you do missions for an organization who wishes to train you in perhaps an extra ability or two(using leves and guildmarks)?

I know I seem hostile, I will try to be a bit more calm in the future.


I should be burned for how many times I've edited this post to add on to it.

If you removed the class names and levels, and just had it so after a certain amount of SP you gaine dyou unlocked abilities would that not be the same?> It should, that's how I view the system.

I know there are problems with the current abilities granted(many of them suck, some are just too good). I see the classes as skills. If you played ultima online take Gladiator as the sword skill. Eventually they added a few abilities to the skill, but originally you got nothing. Just because you had a sword didn't mean you were a tank, just a person who uses a sword. You could then mix this with parrying(which would be sentinel in ff14) to create a shield using 'tank'.

I want to preserve that feeling. The ability to create what I want. There are problems, so anyone willing to offer suggestions shouldnt be lambasted by someone like myself, but I disagree with it being as rigid as you suggest.

The way it is set up it seems to mimic the UO system with just more abilities granted over your skill level(100% in UO, and lvl 50 in FF14). I feel the current system offers more.

[Siatdiat]

Your tree system isn't what I have issue with it's the fact you cannot wrap your head around the weapons not being classes but merely the medium that you gain abilities through.

Why does a paladin have to be a class and not just a role I fulfill due to the coices in abilities and stats I make.

Ironically you can't wrap your head around Paladin or Dark Knight not being classes but instead a gladiator focusing on a role. Dark Knights and Gladiators will be able to use all abilities of lower levels under this system, which allows for a large amount of customization still, they just won't be able to use rank 50 Lancer abilities. Limitless customization is a bad, bad thing.

Instead of character uniqueness(which vanishes with the introduction of classes rather than barebones vehicles).

I have already explained this, in my previous post and now here.

I understand your system, I disagree with it emphatically because I prefer to design a character and not level a class. Currently the game allows me to do that. I do not see in your system how it allows me to do that.

Currently you can level all classes/jobs to 50 and then use all abilities from one class on another. The restrictions for doing so are very minor. If you are too mentally slow or too purposefully blind to understand why this is bad, I can't help you. I do however know the developers are not likely to entertain keeping a broken system that has been complained about loudly in forums, and pointed out by a majority of players in a poll.

It's simply a job/sub job/advanced job system with talent trees(which isn't a BAD thing per se' just something I do not enjoy).

Actually it isn't anymore or less of this proposed here than what it is currently. The only difference is that right now there is very little limit to what you can sub, as you can literally sub any skill you have learned on any job with little restriction or weakness in ability. In fact, as I have mentioned, a player can play a melee class, and then use all of another melee classes abilities with little restriction. This gives the classes no real identity at all.

Sorry - to clarify further. Why should I have to unlock another job and then level that to gain specialization when i can just do that as is by mixing the skills giving to me(let's refer to classes as skills).

I have answered this already once again. Can I geta little background on what you intend to do with the current system when you have leveled all classes to 50? I have no groundwork on where to start to critique this because although I am prepared to do so, it is hard to just randomly pick one concept of why this is so important to you just for you to let me know I'm barking up the wrong tree. SO, little kitten. Let me know what tree you reside in.

To clarify further - Why does there have to be some <insert class> here to get x ability anyway? Why not just have you do missions for an organization who wishes to train you in perhaps an extra ability or two(using leves and guildmarks)?

I find it quite humorous that you have proven to me that the current system isn't completely free and open ended, by suggesting a far worse and even more ridiculous concept for character advancement. Seemingly, people all have ADD now and can't make even the slightest commitment to a choice anymore.

I know I seem hostile, I will try to be a bit more calm in the future.

I probably seem hostile, guess I haven't dealt with enough terrible posters yet here to build up any tolerance.

[Seikninkuru]

Ironically you can't wrap your head around Paladin or Dark Knight not being classes but instead a gladiator focusing on a role. Dark Knights and Gladiators will be able to use all abilities of lower levels under this system, which allows for a large amount of customization still, they just won't be able to use rank 50 Lancer abilities. Limitless customization is a bad, bad thing.



I have already explained this, in my previous post and now here.



Currently you can level all classes/jobs to 50 and then use all abilities from one class on another. The restrictions for doing so are very minor. If you are too mentally slow or too purposefully blind to understand why this is bad, I can't help you. I do however know the developers are not likely to entertain keeping a broken system that has been complained about loudly in forums, and pointed out by a majority of players in a poll.



Actually it isn't anymore or less of this proposed here than what it is currently. The only difference is that right now there is very little limit to what you can sub, as you can literally sub any skill you have learned on any job with little restriction or weakness in ability. In fact, as I have mentioned, a player can play a melee class, and then use all of another melee classes abilities with little restriction. This gives the classes no real identity at all.




I have answered this already once again. Can I geta little background on what you intend to do with the current system when you have leveled all classes to 50? I have no groundwork on where to start to critique this because although I am prepared to do so, it is hard to just randomly pick one concept of why this is so important to you just for you to let me know I'm barking up the wrong tree. SO, little kitten. Let me know what tree you reside in.



I find it quite humorous that you have proven to me that the current system isn't completely free and open ended, by suggesting a far worse and even more ridiculous concept for character advancement. Seemingly, people all have ADD now and can't make even the slightest commitment to a choice anymore.



I probably seem hostile, guess I haven't dealt with enough terrible posters yet here to build up any tolerance.

I'll put it simply for you in big letters because apparently you're either a troll or a moron. Probably a mix of the both.


THERE ARE PROBLEMS WITH THE GAME MOST KNOW THIS. SCRAPPING SYSTEMS, ADDING RESTRICTIONS THAT FORCE YOU INTO X SETUP AND REMOVING THE ABILITY TO CREATE A CHARACTER BUT SIMPLY LEVELING A CLASS are not the answers. They are your narrow-minded stoneage answers.

Did you know there a re millions of people out there who thought final fantasy xi was a pile of shit? Crazy huh, you 500,000 can't figure that out can you?


Edit: Oh wise Siatit, I'd love to hear how it's any diff in a year or so when everyone has every CLASS leveled to 75 or 50 or 80 or 90 whatever the cap may be. Everyone can do everything. How terrible that will be.

[Siatdiat]

I'll put it simply for you in big letters because apparently you're either a troll or a moron. Probably a mix of the both.

Let me give a response to this of the same value: Cool story bro.

THERE ARE PROBLEMS WITH THE GAME MOST KNOW THIS. SCRAPPING SYSTEMS, ADDING RESTRICTIONS THAT FORCE YOU INTO X SETUP AND REMOVING THE ABILITY TO CREATE A CHARACTER BUT SIMPLY LEVELING A CLASS are not the answers. They are your narrow-minded stoneage answers.

Quote where I said there were no problems with the game now? Then, quote where myself or Kurokikzae suggested to scrap completely what is currently in the game? As far as I can tell by reading every page of this thread, and making sure I was clear on what was being suggested, the idea is to add this system to what is currently there. In other words there is no scrapping going on here. Are we suggesting adding a bit of restriction? Yes, because the game sorely needs it. The thing is you are unable to grasp exactly how lenient the system is and are baselessly attacking it. What you seem to be assuming is that it has at any time been suggested that you will be locked into anything permanently, and you can only come to that conclusion by either not reading or not being able to comprehend what you are reading. By setting abilities as a gladiator that allow you to tank better versus being a damage dealer, you are effectively a paladin just being called a gladiator. What is the difference in that and becoming a class called paladin at the same level? Its like someone mentioned earlier about a Solider becoming a Knight in an older FF game, its a name change but if the Knight was still called a soldier it wouldn't change anything. Classes are a problem that has been suggested by the majority of players in the players polls as being important to the current playerbase, specifically that people want the traditional roles. What is suggested here is actually more open ended than that old FF game and actually adds multiple paths and customization, and actually adds depth by adding passive traits based on which direction you go in. It is more versatile also than the sub job system from ffxi which restricted you to one main class and one sub class. The gladiator will still have access to other low level skills, there is just a limit being placed on the current almost total freedom.

Did you know there a re millions of people out there who thought final fantasy xi was a pile of shit? Crazy huh, you 500,000 can't figure that out can you?

What is your point here, what are you replying to?

Edit: Oh wise Siatit, I'd love to hear how it's any diff in a year or so when everyone has every CLASS leveled to 75 or 50 or 80 or 90 whatever the cap may be. Everyone can do everything. How terrible that will be.

What are you implying here? I understand you disagree and think that I'm wrong but you have yet to refute anything I have said. Like I said before, name calling and shit talking doesn't hurt me at all. However, when that is the full value of what you post, and there is no other substance other than saying I am wrong and you are right, and that its just because thats what you think, then I find your posts pathetic. Good job continually trying to get a rise out of me, I'll continue to shoot down your drivel and then let you rant back at me.