Because apparently, counting in increments of two is too damn hard...

[Fornix]

I'm not blaming you TS but you should make a macro.
Isn't that the reason the party wiped again and again? Because lack of communication?
And don't forget you're joining a Pugs not a static.

Should he really be needing to join TS or macro? Is the whiping in this case really due to the TS not being on VoIP or not using a macro? I highly doubt it. There's 2 possible ways this fight could have gone down:

A - The TS was solo tanking. In that case, he was maintaining up 3 stacks and only required 1 orb occasionally. There's no need to tell DPS when to eat orbs in this matter, they should always be eating the remnants.
B - They were tank swapping, in that case, what was preventing the other tank from telling people on TS when to pick up orbs?

To be fair, it sounds more like they were merely looking for someone to lead them through the fight. Rather than being a true farming party.

[Trixxy]

'Farm' parties are supposed to consist of people who feel comfortable with the entire fight and all of its mechanics, the most communication that should take is discussing how other people's groups cleared the fight before to prevent mistakes I.e. Everybody knowing their role. If a fight is beatable without VoiP's then that should be the benchmark of a 'farm' party, otherwise it frankly isn't one in the first place. But hey, that's what's currently so wrong about PF, people name theirs 'farm' parties in hopes of finding the best possible players when other people join expecting the same thing. People should quit searching for free carries and only join the PF's they are supposed to; learning (no to little exp), progression (exp up to a certain point/mechanic), kill (close to having cleared it, mostly familiar with each mechanic) and farm (enough clears and exp to be able to easily coordinate with players on the same level). I really don't get what's so difficult about that.

[Lyrinn]

Here's my take on it.

You are right in that in an ideal situation, you should not need VoIP or a macro. They are wrong for requiring you to get on VoIP and kicking you over it.
However, your attitude also sucks. Making a macro does not take a lot of time nor effort and goes a long way in communicating with your party, and communication is an essential element of teamplay. If the group was competent but simply lacking organisation, then that one macro could have gone a long way towards clearing and saved everyone time and frustration. Again, in an ideal world, you shouldn't have to but the world is never ideal. Sometimes, you have to lead and carry the group to victory.

[Xenor]

I agree that he shouldn't need TS or a macro, but in a PUG you want to eliminate as many variables as possible and increase the chance of success to as high as possible. People with one win will join a farm party, it doesn't mean they're experienced enough to get through without help. Others might have cleared multiple times and be used to people calling it out. Therefore you try to minimise the chances of wipes with better communication. A macro can do that.

[Symbiant]

Always play to the lowest common denominator in pug groups. Typically when you see "Farm Party" = "Fail Party" be ready to wipe. Voice coms are not always needed but, it is to be assumed that when someone states "get on ts" that people should get on ts

[Evaddaragon]

Most people that tell me I should have made a macro obviously missed the last part I added.

We were tank-swapping. There was ANOTHER tank. He didn't use a macro as well, nor was he talking on TS. Yet, HE was NOT blamed. I WAS. Care to tell what's the logic here ?

And no matter what you're telling me, saying I'm lazy for not doing something I wasn't asked to in the first place just confirms what I keep saying. It's remembering every SECOND thunderstorm. That is NOT hard at all to remember. Telling you can get mixed up is bullshit. I have tried this fight as DPS and it is NOT hard. At all.

Yes, it is not hard to simply make a macro. But saying it's the reason the party fail is the biggest idiocy here. They labeled themselves as a "farming" party. Had I gotten into a "progression" party, then I suppose I have only myself to blame.

[Tiggy]

2- There is NO WRITTEN OR OFFICIAL rule whatsoever that says the tank has to tell you when to pick up the orbs. So if you don't ask him to be in charge of that at the beginning, don't blame the tank for YOUR slacking off.

Every single group I've ever tanked for expected me to vocalize this information over voice chat or to have macro's instead. Don't complain because you weren't doing something that most groups expect from a tank. It doesn't have to be written or official for it to still be your job in this fight. Sure, they should know it's every other phase, but things happen and sometimes theres and overcharge or something goes wrong and you have to wing it. This is where your communication is extremely important and definitely helps save wipes.

Stop acting like a victim. You weren't helping anymore than the DPS were or the bad team leader was for failing to properly identify the problem. You were all wrong. A bad group is a bad group.

[Evaddaragon]

Stop acting like a victim. You weren't helping anymore than the DPS were or the bad team leader was for failing to properly identify the problem. You were all wrong. A bad group is a bad group.

Woah, woah, woah. I'm not "acting" or anything. But let's say I bite and follow your logic for a second... I we were ALL wrong, then I don't have the to be THE ONE kicked. A party disband should have been the end result.

Disagreeing with me is one thing. Giving me intentions is another.

And that's funny that you say every single group you've tanked expected you to do it, therefore I'm at fault, because most groups I'VE been in DIDN't expect me to. Funny how that works huh.

This story reminds me a lot of the debate I've heard last year over the marking of targets and about who's responsible to do it, actually, but I digress.

[Tiggy]

Woah, woah, woah. I'm not "acting" or anything. But let's say I bite and follow your logic for a second... I we were ALL wrong, then I don't have the to be THE ONE kicked. A party disband should have been the end result.

Disagreeing with me is one thing. Giving me intentions is another.

And that's funny that you say every single group you've tanked expected you to do it, therefore I'm at fault, because most groups I'VE been in DIDN't expect me to. Funny how that works huh.

This story reminds me a lot of the debate I've heard last year over the marking of targets and about who's responsible to do it, actually, but I digress.

I'm not saying you being the one who was kicked was right. I said everyone was wrong. That includes the party leader who failed to A) discuss a common strat so that everyone was on the same page and B) correctly identify problems and fix them and C) maintain the group with a conversation to fix the problems.

However that doesn't make you right. You say most groups don't expect you too call out. So that tells me you are saying you have been in groups that did have you call out so you knew it was something that is commonly required of the tanks. I would be shocked if you told me that in those battles you helped call out on that there wasn't a palpable improvement in tunnel visioning and rhythm of the fight.

Even if you aren't asked you should know that it helps and embrace that as part of your standard approach to this fight. I've seen the effect of call outs in many fights over the last year. Titan extreme landslides/plumes, Levi plumes/boat side, T5 twisters, etc. In every situation call outs improve the cohesion of the group and help cut through tunnel vision. Just because you weren't asked to do so doesn't change the fact that you should have been doing it and it would definitely have helped the fight.

Take some personal responsibility. You knew some groups ask for this and you still didn't do it. Do you have to be explicitly asked to do cool downs for big hits or do you do it automatically because it's your job? On some fights call outs ARE your job and you shouldn't need to be explicitly asked to do it. This is one of them. Embrace it. Instead you come to the forums acting like a victim when there was blatantly something you could have been doing to improve the situation. The party leader was wrong to act that way and the other tank should have been assisting you, but he was right. You should have been calling them out.

[Kletian]

In phase 3 it isn't so simple. You need to save orbs for tether breaks, sometimes the tank will need to extend, etc. In my past 3 clears, I've clicked my "save orbs" macro at least 3 times in a row in at least 2 separate batches. Fact is, the tanks need orbs when the main guy has less than 25 seconds on his buff- one Tank can focus the other and thus always have a good reference for when that is; the DPS/healers can at best focus on one tank.