It's about time to add Coil story mode, isn't it ?

[Kuwagami]

Is not that bad of an idea but that time already pass. You cant base a new idea for patch that already passed. You cant implement that now because it would be a big mess and even confusing.

Oh at that point I know it's late. I'm not even sure why I keep answering to this thread, as it was relevant then, isn't that much now, but was necro'ed and kept going on until now. Maybe I just don't like to leave things unclear, which seemed to be the case, and I just kept on answering people as they came here to discuss again and again.

I do hope though that SE makes a move when 3.0 lands, even if it means nerfing T5 and T9 to the ground until they're only a shadow of what they were if it's what it takes to allow people to get the end of 1.0. I also hope they won't put important story tied to main scenario in future raids (whether people like it or not, Coil is tied to 2.0 main story, as it explains why we have 2.0 at all).

But that's an other thing, which should not be discussed here.

You want a nerfed/unnerfed version of the previous content correct?

correct. Or rather, I would have wanted. As it has been said, it's too late either way to do it, and next raid won't have Coil's problem regarding storyline and difficulty setting if devs' words are to be trusted.

But you do not want progression to be done through story mode.

Partly true. Progression on relevant content would be locked out of story mode. So progression in prime content would be regular only, progression in story mode could be done if the turn is available. T5 story would unlock T6 story when it comes, then T9 story would unlock T13 story when it comes.

Why would developers do this? Its more work than needed.

I never said it was less work. It was an alternative keeping the originals and easing furthermore the story progress for people (T5/T9, I won't say it again). The extra work is a major drawback and I was fully aware of that.

If you really want to add challenge, you have the option of turning the echo buff off and wear gear that was relevant in it's time. Its all already there.

No it's not. you can go in T1/T2 without any silence, even without echo or overgearing. T4's enrage is only half of what it was. T6 and T7 aren't even worth mentioning, they're just sad jokes now. removing echo can't bring back what the turns were.

[Velhart]

No it's not. you can go in T1/T2 without any silence, even without echo or overgearing. T4's enrage is only half of what it was. T6 and T7 aren't even worth mentioning, they're just sad jokes now. removing echo can't bring back what the turns were.

Now bring it to the community perspective. Who would do an unaltered version of that Coil? Most people go back to this content for different reasons, but the thrill of it's challenge is the least one. If people are farming it all day, they will obviously want the version with least resistance. It is just how society works.

[Tiggy]

Now bring it to the community perspective. Who would do an unaltered version of that Coil? Most people go back to this content for different reasons, but the thrill of it's challenge is the least one. If people are farming it all day, they will obviously want the version with least resistance. It is just how society works.

It's not how people have been reacting. Lots of people, for me most people I've talked to, bemoan the loss of the old versions.

[Kuwagami]

Now bring it to the community perspective. Who would do an unaltered version of that Coil? Most people go back to this content for different reasons, but the thrill of it's challenge is the least one. If people are farming it all day, they will obviously want the version with least resistance. It is just how society works.

Not if (again, as I suggested) story mode has no loot. (the story itself is a far sufficient reward). Also, I second Tiggy on that. Everyone I know who has known the "real" SCoB is mad at the nerfs (well, was. They're now on FCoB and don't give a crap about SCoB anymore as they got everything they wanted there). Especially on T7. Petrification has fallen so low there is no real point keeping it except the damage buff on lamias.

[Waffilicious]

Just take out Twisters instant death from T5 the rest are beatable just like any EX primal

[Tiggy]

Just take out Twisters instant death from T5 the rest are beatable just like any EX primal

If people can't watch the cast bar and run in a small circle or straight line until the cast is done then they aren't going to have much better luck elsewhere. Seriously though this is a simple mechanic. Run in a straight line. Simpler than some actual Extreme primal mechanics. Why is this so hard for people?

[Kinseykinz]

Semi-off topic

If people can't watch the cast bar and run in a small circle or straight line until the cast is done then they aren't going to have much better luck elsewhere. Seriously though this is a simple mechanic. Run in a straight line. Simpler than some actual Extreme primal mechanics. Why is this so hard for people?

I think why people have trouble with this battle specifically is 1. it's length and phase shifts, and 2. This is really the FIRST time in-game setting a 'focus target' is necessary...and quite simply, people don't understand how to do it/why. Now that's 100% on them, but considering how far they got in the game to reach the point of T5 and not needing/understanding how to set a 'Focus Target' there's also a 'hmmm devs' thing in there likely. I have helped many people get their first clears, telling them 'set focus target' only to get into the battle and have them wipe there and go 'what is focus target'....and then needing to explain how to do it.

Basically, I think some people are confused when told to 'focus target' they think it's an order...not a hud option (like they think they're being told to attack the monster, not keep the monster's hp bar up and to watch that bar for monster actions...like some DO set it, but don't get that they should be reading the monster's attacks on it). Also, I don't think they are understanding that they need to do this to watch the bar because they will likely be dpsing another mob at the time these twisters are happening (basically, they tunnel-vision).

Also, people don't put their focus target bars in 'smart' places on their screens (again their issue). But the bar naturally isn't close to anything you'd likely be looking at while battling in the hud. As a healer main, I moved my focus target bar right beside the tank's health bar in the party list....some DD's I know like to put it right near their targeted enemy health bar.

Now is this all the players fault. Yup. But this is why so many people screw up twisters...they simply aren't setting/using properly their 'focus target'....and this fight had enough going on for many people without it also being the introductory course to 'how to properly manage your Focus Target Bar/hud layout'.

Oh...and also by the time people get to this portion of the battle, they tend to be stressed from the prior phases (also a player problem).

Just take out Twisters instant death from T5 the rest are beatable just like any EX primal

But EX primals DO have instant-kill mechanics. And people whine about (most of them) less. Fall off the boat in Levi=insta kill. Over-DPS Iffy EX= insta Kill Don't DPS the bomb fast enough in Titan EX=Instakill (although maybe it can be out-geared now...been awhile), Don't zerg Moogle King Fast enough=instakill...as does not Esunaing/Leeching the debuffs in that battle. Kill Garuda's Plume too fast=insta kill etc....

The main reason people don't over-whine about most primal ex battles though is because:
Simply put, there's usually only 1-3 gimmicks in any given ex primal you need to handle/learn and then you're peachy-keen. Also, the progression you naturally take in the story/development doesn't 'surprise' you quite as much as the jump in turn difficulty can in BC. (IE T1-4 easy/peasy then T5 smacks you in the face with different phases/mechanics and a much different degree of difficulty).

[Waffilicious]

snip

Yeah they do have instant kill attacks dmg wise which some can be survived later on because of gear, but twisters do 0 dmg they just kill you AND push people around you to the fire wall of stuned doom which makes it kind of annoying for experienced people trying to help just to be wiped by a newbie who didn't know how it worked and blew everyone to the wall.

As far as i've seen in all the ex primals non of the primals have such an easy to make a mistake and kill everyone type of mechanic, yeah ifrit might have the chain and nails but you can see and learn that fast enough, and garuda might have the spikey but you can teach that fast enough too, twisters are mines that pop below you and many people just don't know how to react with things they don't see pop with target areas. (yeah you tell them to move and they do but they stumble into another party member mine more often than not)

[Velhart]

Whoever thinks Alexander(Normal) is going to be a walk in the park and free cutscenes are going to be very disappointed. Willing to bet a lot of groups are not even going to pass normal mode until a patch later. There is more factors to take in like having to learn mechanics, get proper gear since everyone will be a new lv.60 and will not start with the best gear possible to start these raids. Not to mention, if SE decides to change the dynamic of how fights go, it is a learning curve all over again. We also have new jobs that we may want to learn to utilize and people learning new rotations from added abilities to their job. I can keep going on, but no, you are not going to beat normal mode quickly, I can almost guarantee it.

[Kuwagami]

Whoever thinks Alexander(Normal) is going to be a walk in the park and free cutscenes are going to be very disappointed. Willing to bet a lot of groups are not even going to pass normal mode until a patch later. There is more factors to take in like having to learn mechanics, get proper gear since everyone will be a new lv.60 and will not start with the best gear possible to start these raids. Not to mention, if SE decides to change the dynamic of how fights go, it is a learning curve all over again. We also have new jobs that we may want to learn to utilize and people learning new rotations from added abilities to their job. I can keep going on, but no, you are not going to beat normal mode quickly, I can almost guarantee it.

and yet again, noone ever said that. But you can keep on believing that if it makes you feel better


a bit too hot-heated here on my part I guess