Yes or No.Craft Mastery Limit.

[Zkieve]

People not familiar with economics.

Because that's the reason for the mastery to exist, and if you can't grasp the concept of economics you're not really eligible to have an opinion about it (that should be taken into account).

By you I mean "you people" by the way.

so basically you need a degree in economics to talk about a game ,
Now i heard it all.How dare we.(not like im completely against mastery just not ffxi type of mastery, mule wise).

[Betelgeuzah]

so basically you need a degree in economics to talk about a game ,
Now i heard it all.How dare we.(not like im completely against mastery just not ffxi type of mastery, mule wise).

No, you do not need a degree to talk about a game.

Yes, you do need to be somewhat informed to talk about a game economy (that mimics RL economy). Much like you need to be somewhat informed about game mechanics to talk about them, too.

This thread steps outside merely game mechanics. Crafting mastery has nothing to do with game mechanics and all to do with game economy.

You can still say what you think, of course, but don't think that opinion has any weight on what should be done.

[Amineri]

No, you do not need a degree to talk about a game.

Yes, you do need to be somewhat informed to talk about a game economy (that mimics RL economy). Much like you need to be somewhat informed about game mechanics to talk about them, too.

This thread steps outside merely game mechanics. Crafting mastery has nothing to do with game mechanics and all to do with game economy.

You can still say what you think, of course, but don't think that opinion has any weight on what should be done.

I find it interesting that you bring up the point of 'economics', in particular mimicking RL economy. In RL economy there is no "rule" or "limit" that says that once you have one college degree, you are then completely constrained from obtaining another. Instead, the limits are based on time invested, and cost/benefit of continuing training vs. practicing the learned skill in order to earn an income.

I think that the issue at stake here revolves around "artificial" and "arbitrary-feeling" limits placed upon character growth. I don't argue that some form of change needs to occur to encourage crafting specialization. I feel that place artificial limiters in place is contrary to the game's philosophy. There are other designs that can encourage specialization without such a mechanic.

As an example, a mechanic of branching craft specialization could be introduced. Within clothcrafting, after rank 50, clothcrafting as a general skill could not be ranked up. Instead, crafting body pieces, hats, gloves, cloth, yarn, lures, etc would each be ranked up separately. Perhaps this could occur to rank 60 at which point another sub-branching could occur.

This system does not place an arbitrary restriction upon players. It simply models an ever-increasing time commitment required to fully master each craft. (The mechanic where-in I become better at making vintage robes because I made 12,000 pieces of wool-cloth is somewhat counter-intuitive, imho.) If structured properly, the amount of time required for a single character to master all branches of all crafts could be prohibitively long, on the order of years. However, learning in depth to master a single facet of a craft could be accomplished fairly easily.

My $0.02

[darkstarpoet1]

No, you do not need a degree to talk about a game.

Yes, you do need to be somewhat informed to talk about a game economy (that mimics RL economy). Much like you need to be somewhat informed about game mechanics to talk about them, too.

This thread steps outside merely game mechanics. Crafting mastery has nothing to do with game mechanics and all to do with game economy.

You can still say what you think, of course, but don't think that opinion has any weight on what should be done.

actually according to basic economics 101 you are wrong. the fewer the people that can do things the higher the cost will become. it's called supply and demand. if the supply falls(due to mastery in that craft) and the demand rises(due to new players in the game) then the price will automatically raise. that is not how you revive a struggling economy.

you revive it by getting more people into the system and using the system not taking people that have taken the time to level a craft out of it. if you think that mastery will not keep people from making high end gear then you are mistaken. if an item takes a r40 class people already go to the r50 for it instead of the 40 because they are more likely to succeed. if you add mastery then those people will stop using the regular 50 crafters and only use the mastered ones. those people will, in turn, raise their prices because there will be less people that can make the item.

[Razor]

actually according to basic economics 101 you are wrong. the fewer the people that can do things the higher the cost will become. it's called supply and demand. if the supply falls(due to mastery in that craft) and the demand rises(due to new players in the game) then the price will automatically raise. that is not how you revive a struggling economy.

you revive it by getting more people into the system and using the system not taking people that have taken the time to level a craft out of it. if you think that mastery will not keep people from making high end gear then you are mistaken. if an item takes a r40 class people already go to the r50 for it instead of the 40 because they are more likely to succeed. if you add mastery then those people will stop using the regular 50 crafters and only use the mastered ones. those people will, in turn, raise their prices because there will be less people that can make the item.

While many of the points you make are valid, you are missing a very big issue currently. Money also changes hands through the making of submaterials. If everyone can make every submaterial they need for those high up recipes they do not need to depend on anyone else and therfore makes no economic impact until the final sale of the item. In business there is a concept called vertical consolidation which is what many players are doing, creating a system where they do not need to depend on any outside assistance. While at the end of the day its good for profit it hurts all the other developing crafters because there are now few submaterials for sale to people. For someone like me as a developing leatherworker ive had to follow suit and start my own low level vertical consolidation just to make my recipes. There will always be the exchange of finished goods between players for money; the economy will survive that way. However, crafter to crafter is also a huge part of the economy as many crafters are also players themselves.

Edit: By "players" i meant DoW/DoM just to make that separation from those that exclusively craft/gather