Goodbye cleric stance.. you will be sorely missed

[Lycinder]

Snip.

We have a bind...WUT...Is it one of the pvp skills because then I might of overlooked or its a thing which uses a cast bar which I generally ignore anyway, shadow flare has a small chance of slowing an enemy so, Yay?
I'm of the percentage of scholars who don't have stoneskin since it is useless to us most of the time (adlo shield is more and just...Better stoneskin only has a 30 minute stick on benefit to that) I use my cross class for a different thing, a 300 potency heal is not a "damn near back up to full health" in any sense of the word.

Continued in next post

[Lycinder]

There are ways for a couple dps classes in the know to make us drop our aetherflow to make us unable to use lustrate though yeah we have a 25% X3 heal every 1 minute, if we popped an aetherflow earlier we are still royally boned. I have said leeches has a really short cooldown but it doesn't stop it from getting interrupted, I have only noted it because I sometimes assume it went off and found out shortly afterwards it didn't, the moment I get back on my chocobo I will still likely get heavy again so yeah a lot of time is wasted inbetween.

Continued again since post limit rarghhh

[Tridus1x]

Scholar's have a Bind

Name the skill that binds.

[Zerotrocity]

Name the skill that binds.

Blizzard 2

[Seoulstar]

snip

What a lovely generalization you have there. Not every whm runs into a fight spamming holy, in all honesty..I rarely see it Also, why shouldn't a healer engage in a 1 vs 1? It's pvp, the healer should be able to defend itself, not just "Oh my god, an enemy! I'm going to run away!" Out of all the games I have played. This is the only one where I've seen this.

Another thing, removing your debuff isn't really an easy thing to do, when the slightest poke will interrupt your casting and don't say the whole swiftcast, surecast thing. Those two can be countered. Let alone, the "crappy" roamer is really someone who is just capturing the posts while people leave it open and he won't just sit there and watch you run off. Last but not least, you fail to mention anything about scholar healing in pvp despite that's the class that took the biggest impact from it.

[Copestetic]

What a lovely generalization you have there. Not every whm runs into a fight spamming holy, in all honesty..I rarely see it Also, why shouldn't a healer engage in a 1 vs 1? It's pvp, the healer should be able to defend itself, not just "Oh my god, an enemy! I'm going to run away!" Out of all the games I have played. This is the only one where I've seen this.

Another thing, removing your debuff isn't really an easy thing to do, when the slightest poke will interrupt your casting and don't say the whole swiftcast, surecast thing. Those two can be countered. Let alone, the "crappy" roamer is really someone who is just capturing the posts while people leave it open and he won't just sit there and watch you run off. Last but not least, you fail to mention anything about scholar healing in pvp despite that's the class that took the biggest impact from it.

I count running into a fight spamming Holy with sitting on a node spamming Holy. Or instead of SC'ing Medica II, they SC Holy. Or Blizzard II. Point is, wasting a Swift/Sure for DPS skills is stupid as a WHM/SCH. You're expected to keep the other members of your party alive using the tools available to you; not waste your CD's on damaging skills. That's what those you know, DPS classes are for. Tanks included in FL. Of course, there's exceptions, but none a wanna-be DPS WHM or SCH would want to hear because it's too limiting or boring. God forbid, I know.

No. I don't think a WHM or SCH should sit there and engage in a 1v1 while their team is waiting on them to get back to their node. Or when they're expected to be at mid in 30 seconds. Or when they're party has called out another "inc" and instead of getting there just in the nick of time, they choose to play with some roaming tard from GW2's WvW. Yes, a Healer should be able to defend themselves. This doesn't mean sit there for a minute trying to kill another player. SC Sleep, and go to your designated location. There, you've defended yourself against a would-be attacker.

If you need to cleanse yourself of Heavy, do it. It's that simple. Whether you Sure it or not is up to you. Get it done and Sprint away. If it's a melee interrupting your cleanse, knock them away and cast it. Ranged? SC or Sure Aldo then cast it right after. Problem solved. Granted, against BLM, SCH, and SMN is a little more difficult.

Roamers are different than teams that are running a split to back-cap something. When I say "roamer" I'm specifically talking about the 1v1 extraordinaire. The people who think 1v1 is the epitome of PvP, and feel that all other forms are pointless, and damn working as a team in a game mode designed specifically for team play. You see these types of players sitting at mid, just hoping for a player to show up early. Or skulking around nodes that may or may not need to be capped and chase you all over Frontlines to prove that you're a noob, and they're pro if they kill you somehow.

And what about SCH healing? They're great in PvP. I don't think them losing Cleric Stance does anything to that aspect of their job.

[Lycinder]

Snip.

Kind of going around in circles/ your ignoring the counterclaims to your points.
Problem with Scholars are they are great in pvp thanks to the rotation and adaptability granted by cleric stance, so losing that hits them really really hard, I understand you don't play scholar in pvp but trust me its a real game changer this update.
The sheer amount of time it take to run away from an encounter from a dps since they can just put heavy back on you when you mount back up (If you sprint they sprint, a good dps can sprint and time a tp recovery quite well from my experience in 1 v 1, tricky little things I know) I actually only ever engaged in 1 v 1 to scare off the guy bothering me, I rarely got a kill but just running away is slower than scaring them off with dps mixed with healing rotation (If it was a scholar bets were generally off.)

A lot of your "Problem fixed" does not help a scholar in any way.

You can type your long reply then select the entire thing and copy it - type a post with 10 letters like (I am editing this post) and reply to the thread, then edit your post and paste the long reply.

This helps you avoid the word limit without taking up more than one space.

Thanks for the info bud

[YukiSama]

I think the most upsetting part of this for me is that it is removing an ability that a class learns naturally. I understand moves like provoke don't work because how would you properly make it achieve the same results vs another player? Cleric stance has a legitimate reason for it be used in a pvp setting. And now whms have 1 less effective ability in comparison to other classes while having to endure even a small breeze interrupting their spells. I'm getting tired of having to try 200% more than others to even manage in pvp situations. Why should I even try being a team player by healing when it feels like the game itself is against me?

[Zyphione]

The change was made because very high statistics of people could not deal with healers and especially not in 7 person white mage parties with 1 black mage or a full white mage party who does nothing but cast holy. They are capable of defeating anyone in a 15-20 yd radius of themselves and the single black mage is for desperate times to limit break?

I can see this as one of the prime reasons for removing cleric stance.

[Lycinder]

Well with very little in the way of escape skills/stuns us scholars new job will be laying down and waiting for death the moment anyone targets us.
I mean I was expecting an eventual nerf to the damage at least scholars do in PVP but I didn't think it would be this huge a nerf, I'm already planning to get a dps to 50 to pvp now and if that is what other healers are thinking about we are about to have a horrible season of frontlines.

Edit -

The change was made because very high statistics of people could not deal with healers and especially not in 7 person white mage parties with 1 black mage or a full white mage party who does nothing but cast holy. They are capable of defeating anyone in a 15-20 yd radius of themselves and the single black mage is for desperate times to limit break?

I can see this as one of the prime reasons for removing cleric stance.

Yeah I was expecting a dps nerf (yeah WHM team holy spam is an ouch moment) but now Healers are pretty much rendered useless (Well scholars mainly WHM still has a couple lifelines) because we almost have no offensive capability other than tickling the opposition and the moment we are targeted by anyone and therefore unable to cast heals (other than swift and the 3 lustrates we get a minute) we have nothing to do but die, and as the general idea is to go for the healer first it looks like we are going to have a repeat in what was mostly the wolves den strategy (Healer goes down quickly, the first healer going down marks the loss for the team which loses it, GG)