Are you happy with the current raiding structure in this game?

[FriendlyUncle]

We need larger group sizes for raids and more of them. The thing with WoW content early on was that raiding took time to progress through. I'm not sure how it is right now but I imagine there are groups that smash through T6-9 in a single sitting and that is it. They are done that week. WoW early on yeah they didn't have anything til MC but just before their first expansion you have MC, BWL, ZG, and Naxx for the masochists. Throw into the mix the idea of varied group sizes and its a good deal. We need 24, 16, and 8 man raiding content and a variety of it. This gives content for small and large FCs to tackle and they can add in normal and savage difficulties.

The lack of more raid content is really rough on the raiders, I don't even get into it much on XIV but it seems like a lot of the raider types are being left twiddling their thumbs after coil because there is nothing to jump into afterwards. Start off the next expansion with a new 8 man, normal and savage and a 16 man. First big content patch, add in a Savage for the 16 man, the beginnings of a 24 man raid.

At least then once people finish off one raid and are locked out for the week there is some other raid they can go and start working at instead of just logging off til next week.

For as much as people hate on WoW (I do this now as well post-BC) in its hay-day it had a good bit of content to keep both casuals and hardcore raiders busy with stuff. BiS shouldn't always be from just one raid either. Your BiS neck might come from Raid#1 but your boots you have to trudge through Raid#2 to get.

[Prototype909]

Snip.

The more players you involve in an instance the lower the difficulty SE is going to implement. This is why CT is the casual raid, more people = less difficult mechanics. They don't trust or expect more than 8 players to be able to work together cohesively enough to design an interesting raid around. Just the sad truth.

[Edli]

They don't trust or expect more than 8 players to be able to work together cohesively enough to design an interesting raid around. Just the sad truth.

As do I. Some of these fights have multiple one shot mechanisms. Take titan ex in its prime, no echo and low LV gear. One death the vast majority of the times meant wipe. If we're to have the same difficulty for 25 that would mean throwing continuously oneshots at 25 players and expecting not one of them to die for the whole fight. That's just crazy talk. In not a single game I've played with 25, 40 raids a single player didn't have so much influence in the whole fight. In these big fights you're supposed to handle easily one of two deaths.

[FriendlyUncle]

As do I. Some of these fights have multiple one shot mechanisms. Take titan ex in its prime, no echo and low LV gear. One death the vast majority of the times meant wipe. If we're to have the same difficulty for 25 that would mean throwing continuously oneshots at 25 players and expecting not one of them to die for the whole fight. That's just crazy talk. In not a single game I've played with 25, 40 raids a single player didn't have so much influence in the whole fight. In these big fights you're supposed to handle easily one of two deaths.

I agree and thats one thing that is far too prevalent in the game. Cheeky one-shot mechanics. It is shit gameplay and a lazy way to make fights challenging imo.

[skaterger]

The more players you involve in an instance the lower the difficulty SE is going to implement. This is why CT is the casual raid, more people = less difficult mechanics. They don't trust or expect more than 8 players to be able to work together cohesively enough to design an interesting raid around. Just the sad truth.

If they implemented 24 man with the intended audience for raiders who do coil, I don't see what's the problem. As it is, many fc's have 3 or more static groups working on coil and having a 24 man with a separate lockout allows these groups to play together. This achieves 2 things

1) If you are unlucky with rng on 8 man, you have another shot in 24 man
2) Alleviates many of the problems players have not being to do content with their fc

The reason why CT is so easy is that it is clearly meant to be puggable (they only added a queue as alliance recently). I'm sure they could design hard content for 24 man if they wanted to.

[FriendlyUncle]

The more players you involve in an instance the lower the difficulty SE is going to implement. This is why CT is the casual raid, more people = less difficult mechanics. They don't trust or expect more than 8 players to be able to work together cohesively enough to design an interesting raid around. Just the sad truth.

I agree to a point, but there is no reason why they can't design a large scale raid that is difficult. WoW has done it with Naxx, yeah only the super hard core got to see it but they need something they can strive towards and work at as well. Give them some challenging content they can bring a significant portion of their team to that will occupy them after clearing the short quick raids like BCoB. The pubbies can work through it later when it is more accessible to them either through filling spots with another FC group, PF, or Echo.

The amount of challenging content in the game is very slim at the moment. Even as a casual I find very little to be challenging outside a few encounters. I might only have time for a few dungeons a night or a bit of a raid on the weekend but I would like to have some challenging gameplay in those so it at least keeps me awake.

And we certainly need more content that is challenging and rewarding for FCs to try and tackle as a group. Hopefully SE wakes up, I find the game somewhat fun but as someone who doesn't have a static or a lot of time the content is mostly all zerg aside from a few bits and pieces.

[GalkaBikini]

I agree to a point, but there is no reason why they can't design a large scale raid that is difficult. WoW has done it with Naxx

A lot of the difficulty from early WoW raids amount to nothing more than simply numbers. When it came down to it, there weren't really a lot of mechanics. It was, Tank needs to have X amount of HP and X amount of mitigation. Healers need to be able to heal X amount. DPS needs to be able to do X amount of DPS. And any WoW mechanics were moot when you've got DeadlyBossMods practically playing the game for you anyway.

TLDR; Naxx wasn't hard.

[FriendlyUncle]

A lot of the difficulty from early WoW raids amount to nothing more than simply numbers. When it came down to it, there weren't really a lot of mechanics. It was, Tank needs to have X amount of HP and X amount of mitigation. Healers need to be able to heal X amount. DPS needs to be able to do X amount of DPS. And any WoW mechanics were moot when you've got DeadlyBossMods practically playing the game for you anyway.

TLDR; Naxx wasn't hard.

Didn't DBM launch in BC? I'm pretty sure DBM debuted in 2008. Well beyond Naxx.

[GalkaBikini]

We need larger group sizes for raids and more of them.

With as hard as CT1 and 2 are for some people despite how ridiculously easy it is, I'm not sure more large scale raiding is the way to go. Atomos, anyone?

[Lethorian]

With as hard as CT1 and 2 are for some people despite how ridiculously easy it is, I'm not sure more large scale raiding is the way to go. Atomos, anyone?

Yea but that isn't a fair comparrison, ANYONE can que up for CT/ST. For an actual raid situation let's say your FC has 2-3 groups clearing 8-man content, if nothing else to a certain turn. SE then releases content that requires more people and you can now combine your first, second, and if required, third coil groups. You can assume everyone would be in the same voice chat with some sort of centralized leadership. These two scenarios are entirely different. I highly doubt they implemented an alliance system JUST for CT/ST. I'm sure they have bigger plans for it.