Death penalty disparity across players

[kukurumei]

There is a point in that if you're a high level crafter, the damage means nothing to you, so in itself will becomes a stigma.

Though there's also the fact that repairing at zero and repairing at 74% is the exact same price, and thus also can be abused anyway.

The repair system is still not quite what it should be so the bigger problem lies in patchwork of patchwork solutions.

[Takelow]

I must admit i don't understand well this new idea we can now heard in the forum that all players must be equal, which was the time and efforts they put in the game...
How, but, how can we imagine that a player with only 1 rank 50 Job could be as powerfull/skilled than a multipleclass R50 players?
How can you think that a player without craft class can have the same advantages than high level craft players?

It make no sense to me. Isn't MMORPG all about leveling a character in order to increase its strength and ability?
Isn't FFXIV all about multiclass system?

My opinion, is that in an MMORPG, you MUST ACCEPT that your player abilities are directly linked to the time and efforts you put in the game. It is the essence of MMO games IMHO. This implies that peoples that have few hours a week to spent into the game (and i am one of them), will never be as powerfull/skilled as a hardcore player that play this game 18h a day. I don't see the problem with that.

And what will be the point of hardcore players, if their efforts means nothing in the game?

[Kaizlu]

I must admit i don't understand well this new idea we can now heard in the forum that all players must be equal, which was the time and efforts they put in the game...
How, but, how can we imagine that a player with only 1 rank 50 Job could be as powerfull/skilled than a multipleclass R50 players?
How can you think that a player without craft class can have the same advantages than high level craft players?

It make no sense to me. Isn't MMORPG all about leveling a character in order to increase its strength and ability?
Isn't FFXIV all about multiclass system?

My opinion, is that in an MMORPG, you MUST ACCEPT that your player abilities are directly linked to the time and efforts you put in the game. It is the essence of MMO games IMHO. This implies that peoples that have few hours a week to spent into the game (and i am one of them), will never be as powerfull/skilled as a hardcore player that play this game 18h a day. I don't see the problem with that.

And what will be the point of hardcore players, if their efforts means nothing in the game?

I agree with you. But here's the thing, since the game was (or is, I have no idea) as "casual-friendly" people seem to want a r1 player to have the same options and content as a r50 player. While I do see some good arguments, I stand with you: MMORPGs are about growing and actually getting better at things. And the more time you spend working towards personal (or artificial) goals the easier the game will be. You could be the best player, but still you need time to level some ranks.

Now, for the topic at hand. The death penalty is ok. The % of damage you get is a little bit high, but nothing that the current economy can handle.

It's all of the bigger picture:

> People in need of repairs = more gilsink and more work for crafters.
> Player will begin noticing that the gil needed to maintain a higher rank item (in comparison with the player's rank)
is too high seeing as how they don't even get the full benefits of the gear.
> More demand for lower rank items.
> Lower ranked items will lower in price and high rank items will get the price they deserve (it's sad to see a simple R10-20 Wand being more expensive than a r44 one..)
> More work for crafters, and a better economy.

Also it incites players to level up DoH classes and spend more time in the game (that's what SE wants).

At least that's the way I see it.

[Lucinda_Lecore]

to the OP,

O, I can see your frustration about the death penalty affecting the gear you are currently wearing. However, there does need to be an effective death penalty, or we would constantly charge forward like lemmings. I imagine with the heavy loss of % gear takes, you think things through a bit more these days?

I do partially see your point on it leaning towards crafters. But I imagine thats why they introduced dark matter into gear repairs. Before hand, you had to search for obscure items such as oils and ignots to fix your gear. Nowadays you just need dark matter and the respective crafting role. I think this has balanced the gear repair system rather well when concerning death penalties

Lucinda x

[Firon]

Idk i think the DP is fine i died 4 times and still no 0% on none of my equips...

[TheVedis]

People wanted a k.o penalty yoshi is adamant about not adding sp loss. we got what we got.

this

plus, people who level more will always have an advantage which is in this case, repairing their own gear
they already had that advantage before

its not something that can be "fixed" or changed and it is in no way unfair in any sense, crafters earned that right by leveling their crafts

[TonyMontana]

why should we offer anything more than 5-6k when the repair item is not only 4.5k from a vendor but is also a very common drop from the r45 dungeon...and gathering...Anyone who wants anything more than 5-6k for a repair that uses such a common item is just silly.

Do you know how much time it takes to get any craft to R40? Hitting R40 is like 4000+ unfailed high SP synths. The amount of time/gil spent getting there is more than you would spend leveling any 2 fighting jobs to 50. Why would people basicly give their valuable commodity away for almost nothing? As crafters get more and more trivialized less and less people will do the crafting, some people are already seeing multi hour waits to get items repaired. Take care of your crafters and they will take care of you. Or just join a LS that has lots of crafters and get free repairs from them I guess.

[TheVedis]

Do you know how much time it takes to get any craft to R40? Hitting R40 is like 4000+ unfailed high SP synths. The amount of time/gil spent getting there is more than you would spend leveling any 2 fighting jobs to 50. Why would people basicly give their valuable commodity away for almost nothing? As crafters get more and more trivialized less and less people will do the crafting, some people are already seeing multi hour waits to get items repaired. Take care of your crafters and they will take care of you. Or just join a LS that has lots of crafters and get free repairs from them I guess.

just answer his question quite simply

why should you pay more

cuz we aint repairing you unless you do, period, so either pay it, or stay broken

[akisato]

Do you know how much time it takes to get any craft to R40? Hitting R40 is like 4000+ unfailed high SP synths. The amount of time/gil spent getting there is more than you would spend leveling any 2 fighting jobs to 50. Why would people basicly give their valuable commodity away for almost nothing? As crafters get more and more trivialized less and less people will do the crafting, some people are already seeing multi hour waits to get items repaired. Take care of your crafters and they will take care of you. Or just join a LS that has lots of crafters and get free repairs from them I guess.

This.

And what exactly are you save your money for anyway?

[Nixius]

While I believe there needs to be a consequential death penalty, the new addition of gear damage upon return has me frustrated. The reason is because of the simple fact that the more crafting jobs a person has leveled, the less of an impact the new death penalty is to them. People who don't enjoy crafting are penalized more by death than those who do.

Personally I find crafting to be incredibly boring. This leaves me with the option of paying six or seven times the cost of the dark matter at the repair NPC for a 70% fix, or waiting often for hours in town hoping someone else will do it. A high level crafter, on the other hand, can 100% fix up all their stuff in a few minutes and be ready to play again. Even when offering the appropriate dark matter or a gil reward higher than the vendor price of it, my average time to get a set of gear repaired is still 4-8 hours.

The penalty should be equal for all players, no matter what their play time is or what classes they play. SP loss is one way to equalize things, and I'd actually prefer that to what we have now. Before you flame me, consider these two things: One, earning back SP is significantly more fun than waiting for hours in town for repairs. Two, everyone would have an equal ability to recover from a death on their own without the help from a specific class or paying significantly more gil than others. I know crafters are going to dump all over this idea, but really that just reinforces my point. Those who are at an advantage rarely want to lose it.

Controversial I know, so please try to be civil and constructive if you disagree.

As long as there is a cost, I don't really mind all that much. I do think the % should be lowered some though, or at least staggered (say 10% then 7% then 5%).

Also, saying that things are not equal I disagree with, that is kind of like saying people who craft get more gil because they can sell crafted items and it's unfair. People who invest time in crafting should be rewarded for their efforts and this is one way. Also think of the ramifications of removing the crafting benefits from the economy.... for that reason I am more biased to gear being damaged than SP.