PLEASE REMOVE PVP RANK REQ FROM GEAR

[DefendPopPunk]

Isn't this what grinding is? Log on in the game and do some randoms shit get the item and log out? It's how a lot of people see the game right now and it's a big problem.

Everyone has different preferences though and for those that like to grind, saying they aren't earning their gear is ridiculous. Besides, for a long time on these forums you would see thread after thread being made where people were begging the devs for grind content. Maybe they went overboard in their response to those threads, that's a separate debate, but the fact remains that a vocal group on here made it clear to the devs that they wanted grind content. It's not uncommon for people to make countless threads on the same topic and devs respond to that demand, we've seen it since the beta, and I'm sure long before that for 1.0 players. As for pvp gear, I have a feeling Frontlines would be even harder to queue for if pvp gear was unlocked from the start, since I tend to run into a lot of people who say in party chat that they want r38 so they can bail.

[SevenHeavens]

people whining about the grind aren't realizing they're playing a MMO

[Dhex]

Having Rank 40 means you finished the PVP "leveling" grind.

Very little in this game is not a grind; Leveling, Crafting, Gathering, Tomes, Hunt Marks, PVP Rank, Glamours, Atma, Animus, Novus, Dailies - all grinds.

I'll be happy the day they implement a leader-board for PVP; then you'll have a real earned rank that has meaning.


Edit:

people whining about the grind aren't realizing they're playing a MMO

This annoys me and here's why; When did boring and repetitive even painfully dull game-play become acceptable? Grinding is fine - I get it. It extends content life, it gives players goals, and it makes people who have nothing better to do with their time feel special when they're really nothing special at all. I don't find it acceptable to double or triple-down so to speak with your grind structure.

Switch your GC - have fun leveling again. Yay twice the content life and 0 extra work - so clever...

What do you mean Dhex? What I mean is this -> a leveled PVP player has more points giving them an automatic advantage - why did they bother balancing the Jobs and remove morale from Frontlines just to make those endeavors at balance pointless by leaving in a leveling (Rank) system? Why does PVP gear remain Rank locked when PVP gear has been rendered useless in Frontlines? If a GC change requires a time lock gil sink and PVP rank reset because people might flock to the most winning GC for Frontlines why does PVP gear matter?

The answer is it doesn't; GC lock is not in effect for Wolf's Den. Nobody is going to flock to a different GC because of Wolf's Den, but yes gear and Morale work here - but why is it irrelevant? Here's why; players avoided Wolf's Den because the EXP and rewards were low - the Rank matching was slow - and they often were paired with other players that simply had win-traded their way to R40 and bought i100 gear so they could simply overpower any newer or lower rank player that lacked a high level of skill. Yoshida didn't like this - so he gave EP and Rewards to FL to get people in and leveling and getting higher gear... but... nobody uses Wolf's Den anymore not for leveling and not for competition until they can wear the gear and on a equal footing.

Basically they rendered PVP gear useless and 4v4 Arena irrelevant to the majority of people.


Grind for the sake of grind leads to badly designed broken systems; broken reward systems, broken leveling (Rank) system, broken upgrade system, broken competition model.

So yeah - quit accepting badly planned and poorly designed systems left and right or you end up with a sh!tty broken game.

Don't even get me started on the weekly-lockout-single-raid or Hunt-free-for-all format in PvE - Yoshida and his team have been making a lot of mess out of their own game lately and people need to let them know that they need to put more polish and direction into their vision.

[DefendPopPunk]

Why does PVP gear remain Rank locked when PVP gear has been rendered useless in Frontlines?

Yoshi-P already said that they're going to change the stats on pvp gear so they're not useless in frontlines.

[DefendPopPunk]

You say we shouldn't accept bad design. So we clamor for changes and they say they'll make changes. And then you fault them for fixing things in retrospect (in response to us asking for changes). It just seems like they can't win either way with you.

[Dhex]

You say we shouldn't accept bad design. So we clamor for changes and they say they'll make changes. And then you fault them for fixing things in retrospect (in response to us asking for changes). It just seems like they can't win either way with you.

"Win" would have been to put in accessible large group 8v8v8 PVP without any restrictions (ie; not tied to Ranking/Leveling) on abilities and had it completely without Morale or PVP oriented gear and without a GC restriction so people could learn and enjoy it with friends - then later implemented team based 4v4 PVP where you need to register with a GC or make a Team and register for a PVP season. Ranks based on class, overall performance, k/d ratio, assists, captures, healing/damage dealt, and team wins to determine both player individual rank and team rank. Gear and morale would have a purpose in 4v4 and you'd need to be registered for a season to get extra points to make your PVP build. Rank resets each season, gear gets added every few patches same iLv but different stats and effects for depth, and a trophy for the top 3 teams on each server.


But that's not what we got, and it's a mess they're still trying to get figured out because they implemented it backwards and didn't have a core vision or goal for it.

[DefendPopPunk]

"Win" would have been to implement the pvp system that I envisioned.

Fixed it up a bit.

To be honest, looking at your system, I'm confused as to why you would even bother having it 8v8v8 if there is no GC restriction. The whole point of frontlines is that the three GC's are fighting over disputed territory. Without that part, there wouldn't even be a need to deviate from the standard team v team formula, and they already did that with Wolves' Den. That being said, why not 4v4v4v4? Or 2v2v2v2v2? Or anything else different and interesting? And while I understand the desire for clan based pvp a la every fps out there, that isn't what frontlines seems to be about. Who's to say you won't get a system like that in the future? The devs already seem keen to implement such a system anyway, if recent interviews and feedback are to be believed. And when that content comes you can criticize every aspect of it as well, I suppose.

[Dhex]

You can criticize every aspect of it as well, I suppose.

It's just an example - I'm not a a dev. I'm here to play. Making the playground isn't my job but I can recognize when the swing set is broken and the monkey bars are bent. As they say hindsight is 20/20 = you can fix it when you see it's broken.

Maybe I just expect too much - but when I look at the entirety of FFXIV's PVP all I can think is it was intended to be X, came out as Y, and what it really needed to be is Z.

My point:

I want to see a little more forethought and polish. Not more "We made it, it's broken and backwards and kind of derpy, but we made! Oh and uh sorry we're working on fixing it!"

[DefendPopPunk]

I want to see a little more forethought and polish. Not more "We made it, it's broken and backwards and kind of derpy, but we made! Oh and uh sorry we're working on fixing it!"

That's a fair point. I suppose I'm just a little bit more patient with things like this, and while I would also like things to be done right the first time, I still appreciate that efforts are made to fix mistakes and get things into a more enjoyable state.

[DeadRiser]

Nobody wants the stats, just the looks.

I feel you :<