Done with FFXIV until RDM comes along...

[Plainview]

I'm glad people made mention to the refresh bot in XI. It removed RDM from all of it's supposed characteristics (in my opinion). Also, it is my feeling that Giantbane is absolutely correct. A jack or all trades wouldn't work in the current system. Call me crazy, but I think RDM would make a great (and sorely needed) tank. Uses melee attacks and white and black spells would either add threat generation or provide some defensive capabilities. I imagine something between PLD and WAR. Instead of full on mitigator or full on aoe tank, you get something inbetween. I realize this contradicts the jack of all trades statement, but I leave it to the developers to work it out.

TLDR: I think the best fit for RDM in the game's current state is a tank. Just my opinion.

[FriendlyUncle]

I could see it as a tank or a dps with utility (much like bard is now). For a tank it would need some kind of quick cast ability or proc, essentially a Fast Cast that isn't active 100% of the time to mitigate damage through spells like Blink, SS and Regen from WHM. I think with GLD's hate combos, the consistent threat from Regens it would work. It could have 'stances' similar to PLD's Shield and Sword oath that would instead function as Enspells. You could even take them of GDC and work them sort of like THM's Astral/Umbra system but I think I like that better for a DPS style RDM.
Enfire - Adds fire damage to attacks, increases damage dealt by x% Fire spells that critically strike your target cause it to burn for y potency. (Debuff called Flashfire or whatever it doesn't really matter)

Enblizzard - Adds elemental damage to attacks, reduces the damage you take by x%, Critical strikes from blizzard spells on the target encase it in ice weakening the next y amount of attacks (Debuff Flash freeze/deep freeze)

Perhaps add a consumption affect, if you cast Blizzard on a target with Flash Fire it causes a steam explosion for a bit of extra damage and removes the flash fire debuff. This adds a level of do I want to let my DoT run down to the last second to get the most out of it, or detonate it immediately for instant damage. Casting Fire spell on a target with Flash Freeze would cause Sodden (slow and water elemental DoT with x potency. Possibly causing increased enmity.)

At work so I can't pull up all abilities from other classes, just kinda going off the top of my head. THM/CJN I think is sound. Thunder, Blizzard, Fire, Blizzard 2,(is Lethargy BLM or THM?) Stoneskin, Regen, Protect, Raise, Cure.

RDM abilities Barrier? - Astra - Buffs you and nearby party members, reducing damage taken for the next x seconds, could be used to help buff MT during a high damage phase, reduce raid damage(Think Tumult's or something like that, predictable raid damage.) Phalanx - Increases block rate by x and amount blocked by y. Add a flavor mechanic if you like, shield blocks restore some MP maybe. Enfire and Enblizzard, obviously. Blink: Should it be like FFXI Blink where it negates x amount of attacks but the spell obviously needs a cooldown on it or should it be similar to Awareness negating anything that would become a critical?

RDM Tank Soulstone could have the Fast Cast trait/proc built onto it.



I'd prefer it not be a tank but that's just a personal opinion and I could see it working in its own right. I'd like to see it in its traditional role of sort of a melee fighter who uses magic to augment their damage with some support.

GLD/THM - RDM soulstone could have a natural means to negate the enmity generation on RoH chain. It would gain the same cross class skills listed above.

Enfire, it is flavor mainly and could be worked around - Adds fire elemental damage to melee attacks, increases physical damage by x% or potency. Critical strikes from Fire cause Flash Fire burning the target for x potency over y seconds.

Enblizzard - Adds ice elemental damage to melee attacks, increases magical damage by x% or potency. Critical strikes from Blizzard spells on the target cause Flash Freeze causing your next critical hit do deal increased damage(Make next spell or weapon skill 100% crit)

Flash Fire - Blizzard spells cast on a target with flash fire cause a steam explosion dealing additional damage.

Flash Freeze - Fire spells cast on a target with flash freeze cause Sodden, increasing the potency and duration of the next Thunder spell on the target.

So you would probably want to start by trying to get Flash Freeze, hit it with Fire to get Sodden into Thunder. Then be trying to land Flash Fire's into steam explosion for additional damage before refreshing Sodden + Thunder. This is admittedly a very crit-centric style which probably would not work well and the mechanic I suggest need adjusted to allow the class to flow better. This is just an off the cuff idea while I'm sitting here in my cube.

RDM abilities:

L30 - Enfire

L35 - Refresh: 3 Min CD. Refreshes a single target causing them to regenerate x% of the MP over y seconds. (Depending on how solid a RDM's MP is, possible add in 'Additionally you recover z% of the MP that your target does')

L40 - Enblizzard

L45 - Haste - 2-3 Min CD. Increases the Red Mage's skill/speed speed by X for Y seconds.

L50 - Diffusion 3-5 Min CD. Grants the effect of your Enspell to all nearby party members for X seconds.(This could be static, use it during Enfire its going to give everyone Enfire with additional fire damage and increase physical damage for the duration or possibly change as you shift your Enspell. Shifting between magic and physical damage as you do so the effect can benefit any class in the party at different times.)

*These are very generic ideas, I am in no way saying that this is how Red Mage should be implemented into the game. Simply my thoughts on how I could see the class playing at this specific times.

[Sonofbaldo]

FFXIV will never have a full on support job. It's basically just Healers, DD's, and Tanks. The way the entire game is set up it defied the usefulness of a pure support class. I guess if you'd be happy with another DD who can cast a couple of weak RDM spells that's the best you're going to get.

There's never going to be any dynamic jobs because this game is all about being as simplistic as possible. It'll just be one of the usual 3 roles with a different name.

[Alkimi]

FFXI is a great reference at least, cause it was a game that was actually fun and interesting. Combat is bland and beyond mind-numbingly boring in this game.

But FFXI had zero balance amongst the jobs. They just threw a whole bunch of them in there (20 at last count) and people just stacked the most useful ones for any endgame content. It had support jobs yeah, but they were massively overpowered.

Even your precious RDM has been useless since the level cap was raised and it's taken them 4 years to add Haste II to make them relevant again.

[Adler]

I just liked "Done with FFXIV unless I get what I want". Don't really care what jobs and when come out, sorry.

Not done with FFXIV yet though

[Madoka]

Why would RDM have to be a buff/debuffer? Just because that's the role they filled in XI doesn't mean anything here.

[Duelle]

Why would RDM have to be a buff/debuffer? Just because that's the role they filled in XI doesn't mean anything here.

This.

The way the entire game is set up it defied the usefulness of a pure support class. I guess if you'd be happy with another DD who can cast a couple of weak RDM spells that's the best you're going to get.

There's never going to be any dynamic jobs because this game is all about being as simplistic as possible. It'll just be one of the usual 3 roles with a different name.

In a game designed around the trinity, yes, I expect RDM to be a DPS with some form of utility. BRD has the buffs, which is why I think (very limited and extremely situational) off-healing would be the way to go.

As far as the roles, it's not a matter of simplicity. It's a matter of balance.

But FFXI had zero balance amongst the jobs. They just threw a whole bunch of them in there (20 at last count) and people just stacked the most useful ones for any endgame content. It had support jobs yeah, but they were massively overpowered.

To be fair, RDM wasn't overpowered per se. Gear swaps is what made RDM overpowered and Utsusemi didn't help.

Even your precious RDM has been useless since the level cap was raised and it's taken them 4 years to add Haste II to make them relevant again.

What annoys me about this is that it's not like XI's devs were short on ideas that would fit RDM. Instead they got Haste II (AKA the sequel to refreshbot) and a near-insignificant boost to composure via capacity points.

[Kuwagami]

This.
In a game designed around the trinity, yes, I expect RDM to be a DPS with some form of utility. BRD has the buffs, which is why I think (very limited and extremely situational) off-healing would be the way to go.

off healing will be an attribute of the bards if SE wants to follow their logic (healing chant is a classic AND last bard quest)

[Duelle]

off healing will be an attribute of the bards if SE wants to follow their logic (healing chant is a classic AND last bard quest)

To fit within BRD's current gameplay, the healing song from the last BRD quest would have to be nerfed and have a heavier cost. Even then, I'd ask why you would give BRD that when it sort of goes against the "DPS with cooldowns" design the devs followed with BRD.

[Moqi]

off healing will be an attribute of the bards if SE wants to follow their logic (healing chant is a classic AND last bard quest)

I was surprised when I found out that they didn't have a healing song.

Anyyway, I guess RDM's fascination comes from FFXI since buff/debuffs is usually the green mage job (now that I would like to see).