SE's most difinitive statement yet on parsers

[Kaethra]

Key statement is the second to last paragraph: "We would also like to remind players that third-party tools that modify or parse game data violate the User Agreement, and that players who are found to be using these tools will be met with strict disciplinary action."

Sorry to say, but you misread that statement. They said GAME DATA. Which is much different than LOG DATA. While people cannot use Radar or other hacks to find things in game, or modify files, or intercept game transmission from packets sent over a network. This has nothing to do with DPS parses. DPS parses use the log file located in the C:\Users\Username\Documents\My Games\FINAL FANTASY XIV - A Realm Reborn folder instead of where FFXIV is installed.

SE has no control over what you do in that folder. That is where your UI configs and screenshots go as well. You're allowed to view, edit, and modify anything in that folder (otherwise anyone photoshoping their screenshots should be banned too!). The log files are simply text files and all a parser does with those files is read them, apply math, and displays the results. Anyone with notepad and a calculator could produce the same results.

So saying DPS parser users will be banned is like saying anyone using MSPAINT.exe, NOTEPAD.exe, and CALC.exe should be as well.

As for the argument that PS3/4 users can't do things that PC users can't. That's rubbish. There's plenty of things I can do that they can't with my PC that doesn't even compare to cheats. Such as alt tabbing to my browser to look up a wiki, VOIP, and use a myriad of peripherals (I'd be surprised if the PS3 or 4 could use a 17 button gaming mouse). Of course things like Radar and other hacks are bad, but don't lump DPS parsers in with those.

[Amberyl]

They said GAME DATA. Which is much different than LOG DATA.

While it's kinda cute, you are absolutely deluding yourself.

[Kaethra]

While it's kinda cute, you are absolutely deluding yourself.

You want to provide some facts of that? Those files are not located anywhere in the directory that FFXIV is installed to. Take a look yourself.

[Amberyl]

You want to provide some facts of that? Those files are not located anywhere in the directory that FFXIV is installed to. Take a look yourself.

Take a quick look at every single screenshot you take with the client, and tell me what they have in common. (hint, it's located bottom left, and you'd have to be blind not to notice it.)

Just because they don't necessarily enforce their ownership of everything that the client generates rigidly, doesn't mean that it's not theirs. Even the config files are their intellectual property. You either weren't paying attention in beta, or didn't play, but they have, in the past, enforced stricter usage rules of that content.

There is nothing that this game client creates that you own. And rightly so, you didn't make it. Go and read the EULA.

[Kaethra]

Take a quick look at every single screenshot you take with the client, and tell me what they have in common. (hint, it's located bottom left, and you'd have to be blind not to notice it.)

Just because they don't necessarily enforce their ownership of everything that the client generates rigidly, doesn't mean that it's not theirs. Even the config files are their intellectual property. You either weren't paying attention in beta, or didn't play, but they have, in the past, enforced stricter usage rules of that content.

There is nothing that this game client creates that you own. And rightly so, you didn't make it. Go and read the EULA.

I have. And I'll post this:

The manor sentry takes 84
(+22%) damage.
gains the effect of Greased Lightning.
moves into Opo-opo Form.
uses Heavy Swing.
The manor sentry takes 42 damage.
The manor sentry casts Stone.
takes 114 damage.
The manor sentry begins casting Stone.
hits the manor sentry for 45 damage.
You cast Stone II.
The manor sentry takes 144 damage.
uses Maim.
The manor sentry takes 54
(+47%) damage.
gains the effect of Maim.
gains the effect of Wrath III.

That is taken straight out of a logfile (with names taken out). Feel free to report that for breaking the EULA. If it gets removed, you're right. If not, then you're wrong. Point being. We can view this stuff. Whether it is in notepad, clipboard. Or a spreadsheet.

You'll also notice that info is viewable ingame in the Combat Tab (in fact it is the same exact text). Are we going to get banned for clicking on that too?

[Amberyl]

You'll also notice that info is viewable ingame in the Combat Tab (in fact it is the same exact text). Are we going to get banned for clicking on that too?

Retroactively or simultaneously using a third party program to view that data and use it to alter the game experience is a bannable offence, yes. Square aren't dicks tho, and aren't about to cut their nose off to spite their face. The more people rant about parsers however, the more likely it is that generation of the logfile will simply disappear one day.

[Tannlore]

...
The more people rant about parsers however, the more likely it is that generation of the logfile will simply disappear one day.

Pretty much this. Also, I find it amusing that people are arguing with each other how this is or isn't fair/cheating as is any one of us has any say on the matter. SE has spoken, their decision is made and pretty clear. Smacking each other over the heads with interweb toughguy sticks accomplishes nothing but a decimation of my popcorn supply. *sigh* I need to go buy some more now.

[raelgun]

Retroactively or simultaneously using a third party program to view that data and use it to alter the game experience is a bannable offence, yes. Square aren't dicks tho, and aren't about to cut their nose off to spite their face. The more people rant about parsers however, the more likely it is that generation of the logfile will simply disappear one day.

parsers dont alter the game in any means, thats just your imagination, and really really doubt people like that will go away, they are hear to stay and pretty much the ones that keep end game going, as long as end game exists, they will exist no matter what, also addons are coming, we will see a surge of people and trust me when I say the most downloaded addon will be the parsers on all systems.

[Kaethra]

Retroactively or simultaneously using a third party program to view that data and use it to alter the game experience is a bannable offence, yes. Square aren't dicks tho, and aren't about to cut their nose off to spite their face. The more people rant about parsers however, the more likely it is that generation of the logfile will simply disappear one day.

They'd be the first MMO to do it. And to be honest this is the first time I've ever seen anyone place 'log file viewing' up there with cheating. And I've been MMOing since Everquest (with SOE having the strictest policies on that sort of thing, yet still allowing parsers). I doubt they'd disallow it, considering you could parse log files in FFXI.

[Zakalwe]

Sorry to say, but you misread that statement. They said GAME DATA. Which is much different than LOG DATA.

This is the kind of torturous argumentation that led me to start this thread. While SE has been pretty clear in the past that parsers aren't permitted under the TOS, people keep coming up with ingenious reasoning that this certainly is not what their statements really mean. Now a very official statement is put out that mentions parsers by name, and a few hardy souls hang in there. Again, I'm not saying that parsers are good or bad for the game, as that is a different debate. The fact is that SE has most definitively said they currently violate the TOS.