Two handed animations for two handed weapons. Possible?

[TheRogueX]

Go take a long pole, hold it with 2 hands, and imagine how you'd cast some epic magics such as Holy, Flare, Freeze, Firaga etc.

Err, you said "swinging," as in physically attacking with the staff, not casting spells. Also, since Yuna's staff is top-heavy, it'd be remarkably easy to swing it about with one hand, once you got it started. Just wouldn't be easy to control.

[Ooshima]

Err, you said "swinging," as in physically attacking with the staff, not casting spells. Also, since Yuna's staff is top-heavy, it'd be remarkably easy to swing it about with one hand, once you got it started. Just wouldn't be easy to control.

Nope, I am talking about casting a spell. Yuna casts with one hand too. Just take a pole like I said, stand in front of a long mirror and watch yourself 2 hand holding it and swing it around or do some spinning or whatever you imagine yourself as a caster casting some magic.. It just look silly to me.

People hold a certain weapon 2 handed because either it is heavy, or the weapon is intended to be 2 handed due to the strength required to use it. For example, weapons such as an axe, a giantsword (like Cloud Strife/Zack's), a spear (or pike/halberd type), a club, etc.

A caster staff is just... nope. tbh I've never seen any casters in a FF game that uses a staff, but casts a spell with animation 2 handed.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

Nope, I am talking about casting a spell. Yuna casts with one hand too. Just take a pole like I said, stand in front of a long mirror and watch yourself 2 hand holding it and swing it around or do some spinning or whatever you imagine yourself as a caster casting some magic.. It just look silly to me.

People hold a certain weapon 2 handed because either it is heavy, or the weapon is intended to be 2 handed due to the strength required to use it. For example, weapons such as an axe, a giantsword (like Cloud Strife/Zack's), a spear (or pike/halberd type), a club, etc.

A caster staff is just... nope. tbh I've never seen any casters in a FF game that uses a staff, but casts a spell with animation 2 handed.

I'm pretty sure Dagger in Final Fantasy IX used both hands for attacking with her rod and for magic use.

[Ooshima]

I'm pretty sure Dagger in Final Fantasy IX used both hands for attacking with her rod and for magic use.

Scroll to 0:16, she released one hand (although still close to the rod) while summoning Ramuh/Judgment Bolt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-2SMco_pDc

While I agree that Dagger seems casts other spell like heals 2 handed in the above video shown, but don't you think it is dead boring? She's just standing there stationary. 2 hand holding a staff is too movement restricting for casts, really. If you fancy fanciful casting animations and combat style, look at how Yuna moves and animates in Dissidia - I think that's the way to go.

Heck, even the way old man Ramuh in XIV casts his judgement bolt (which is one handed) looks cool. Now imagine him holding his staff 2 handed and does the same cast... I rather he take a giant hammer and really hammer you instead (makes more sense based on movement)

[MilesSaintboroguh]

Scroll to 0:16, she released one hand (although still close to the rod) while summoning Ramuh/Judgment Bolt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-2SMco_pDc

While I agree that Dagger seems casts other spell like heals 2 handed in the above video shown, but don't you think it is dead boring? She's just standing there stationary. 2 hand holding a staff is too movement restricting for casts, really. If you fancy fanciful casting animations and combat style, look at how Yuna moves and animates in Dissidia - I think that's the way to go.

Heck, even the way old man Ramuh in XIV casts his judgement bolt (which is one handed) looks cool. Now imagine him holding his staff 2 handed and does the same cast... I rather he take a giant hammer and really hammer you instead (makes more sense based on movement)

Well I wouldn't expect a game released in 2000 to have superb animations

[Ooshima]

Well I wouldn't expect a game released in 2000 to have superb animations

You have a point there.

With the coming of PS2, PS3 and now PS4, there are greater expectation on movement animations and fluidity, which often, designers look back at physics, aerodynamics and maybe they even have stuntmen trying out stuffs and actions and review them to see which is nice, which is not.

Which I firmly believe that if you hold a staff using 2 hands, it is a huge minus to movement capabilities and fluidity.

[TheRogueX]

Nope, I am talking about casting a spell.

You said, and I quote:

It looks absolutely weird for your BLM/WHM to swing a staff with 2 hands.

Show me in there where you said 'while casting a spell,' because you didn't.

People hold a certain weapon 2 handed because either it is heavy, or the weapon is intended to be 2 handed due to the strength required to use it. For example, weapons such as an axe, a giantsword (like Cloud Strife/Zack's), a spear (or pike/halberd type), a club, etc.

The Quarterstaff is a two-handed weapon. It is neither heavy nor needs a lot of strength in order to be used. Mage staves are more or less just an ornate quarterstaff and designed to be wielded two-handed, when used as a physical weapon to strike with. Also clubs are small, 1 handed weapons, usually. Unless you're talking about the tsuba, of course, which is a giant freaking stick of death. "Giantswords" like what we see in anime and video games never existed, though there were some pretty big swords out there (bidenhänder, zweihänder/flammenschwert, daikatana, etc). I'm starting to think that you might not really know what you're talking about, lol.

[Ooshima]

I'm starting to think that you might not really know what you're talking about, lol.

I'm questioning your physics logic, lol.

Mage staves are more or less just an ornate quarterstaff and designed to be wielded two-handed, when used as a physical weapon to strike with.

Erm... yes... so? FFXIV, your mages in XIV hit physically with their staff? No, they cast spell.

Also clubs are small, 1 handed weapons, usually. Unless you're talking about the tsuba, of course, which is a giant freaking stick of death.

Yes of course, big ass clubs that are meant to be swung two hand and deal massive damage. I'm not keen in sissy weapons for physical/melee characters.

Giantswords" like what we see in anime and video games never existed, though there were some pretty big swords out there (bidenhänder, zweihänder/flammenschwert, daikatana, etc).

I already stated Cloud's weapon as an example previously. Jecht's sword is pretty gigantic for another example. Whilst these 2 characters does have the strength to hold and wield them single hand to a certain degree, but these weapons are usually 2 handed.

My post above [ http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post2325160 ] have further explanations to why mage staff should continue to be one-hand holding for obvious animation reasons.

I'm not interested in movement restricting and boring cast animations like Dagger in IX did.


EDIT: Ultimately, it is undoubtedly that single hand holding of a staff gives greater potential for movement animation and fluid movements. Like I said, go take a pole and stand in front of a mirror and try movements with it, single hand and double hand. The results and impressions you get is just, obvious. Holding it 2 handed just reminds you of axes and swords mostly.

[TheRogueX]

I'm questioning your physics logic, lol.

We're not talking physics here (at least, not directly). I've used swords, axes, staves, and many other melee weapons. I understand how they work and how they're used in real-world situations, while you seem to only have ideas based on video game logic.

Erm... yes... so? FFXIV, your mages in XIV hit physically with their staff? No, they cast spell.

Yes, actually, they can and do, if you want them to. I sometimes whack things with my staff just for fun. Hell, as an Arcanist I regularly hit things with my book because I can and its HILARIOUS.

Yes of course, big ass clubs that are meant to be swung two hand and deal massive damage. I'm not keen in sissy weapons for physical/melee characters.

Your preferences have nothing to do with realism. A solid, one-handed wooden club can do tremendous amounts of damage to other living creatures (as well as inanimate objects).

I already stated Cloud's weapon as an example previously. Jecht's sword is pretty gigantic for another example. Whilst these 2 characters does have the strength to hold and wield them single hand to a certain degree, but these weapons are usually 2 handed.

And I pointed out that those are not realistic weapons, nor are they being used in an anywhere near realistic fashion. I'm not even sure why you went back to them after I referenced REAL two-handed weapons.

My post above [ http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post2325160 ] have further explanations to why mage staff should continue to be one-hand holding for obvious animation reasons.

I'm not interested in movement restricting and boring cast animations like Dagger in IX did.

EDIT: Ultimately, it is undoubtedly that single hand holding of a staff gives greater potential for movement animation and fluid movements. Like I said, go take a pole and stand in front of a mirror and try movements with it, single hand and double hand. The results and impressions you get is just, obvious. Holding it 2 handed just reminds you of axes and swords mostly.

In the end, however, I wasn't arguing the single-handed use of staves when casting, because I think that looks just fine. I was, however, arguing about *fighting* with them single-handed. Again, you had only said 'swinging' them, not casting spells with them. Also, I don't hold a quarterstaff two-handed anything like how I hold a two-handed sword or axe. They are completely different weapons, wielded in completely different manners.

Now I know you have no idea what you're talking about.

[Ooshima]

We're not talking physics here (at least, not directly). I've used swords, axes, staves, and many other melee weapons. I understand how they work and how they're used in real-world situations, while you seem to only have ideas based on video game logic.

Oh wow we have a badass over here. I have used katanas (Kendo) like they are intended to, and use melee weaponry like knifes etc in the military. Get a hold of yourself lol, it's no big deal.

And sorry, these are basic things near the degree of common sense. If you have seen people who uses them used them, you can tell what looks weird and what not.

Yes, actually, they can and do, if you want them to. I sometimes whack things with my staff just for fun. Hell, as an Arcanist I regularly hit things with my book because I can and its HILARIOUS.

Fun? Sorry, game developers doesn't create a game and design its movement animations to look hilarious because it looks idiotically funny. They are doing a business, mind you. They can, doesn't make they should or it makes sense lmao.

Your preferences have nothing to do with realism. A solid, one-handed wooden club can do tremendous amounts of damage to other living creatures (as well as inanimate objects).

Well it's indeed my preference, which leads to the below

And I pointed out that those are not realistic weapons, nor are they being used in an anywhere near realistic fashion. I'm not even sure why you went back to them after I referenced REAL two-handed weapons.

This is final fantasy, mind you. Whilst not realistic and gravity defying in real life, humongous and beastly weapons adds the element of fantasy in the game. As a gamer, you don't know that?

In the end, however, I wasn't arguing the single-handed use of staves when casting, because I think that looks just fine. I was, however, arguing about *fighting* with them single-handed. Again, you had only said 'swinging' them, not casting spells with them. Also, I don't hold a quarterstaff two-handed anything like how I hold a two-handed sword or axe. They are completely different weapons, wielded in completely different manners.

Okay, fine, go on with your fighting physically with the staff and maybe your books. I am talking about casting spell and the cast animations all the while, mind you. How many times have I said, hold a damn pole and look into the mirror and tell me how silly it'd look if you cast with 2 hands on the staff? All along I am saying this, and you came with counter argument based on physically fighting with a staff! WUT?

Now I know you have no idea what you're talking about.

Ditto.

Or you are just wanting to engage physically with your staff. Sure you can do it if you want to, go ahead and enjoy