Please take a look at LOTRO for the proper way to design end game dungeons

[Adler]

I'm unconvinced that helicanarssis in haukke Manor hard is beatable with minimum ilvl tbh.

If all 4 members know what they do then it can. If 1 member use same 1-2 skills whole fight then no

[givemeraptors]

I'm unconvinced that helicanarssis in haukke Manor hard is beatable with minimum ilvl tbh.

SCH/SMN Virus
SCH Sacred Soil
Caster E4E (ahead of time so it has time to proc)
Tank LB or DD LB
PLD Hallowed Ground + Cover your healer so they can live and rez squishy DPS
BLM can pop Manaward
MNK can use Fists of Earth for 10% damage reduction
DRG... ahh Keen Flurry? Okay he's gonna die.
BRD can play Foe's to boost damage and save all CDs for last add
War can use Storm's Path

I've seen people derp hard on this fight in ilvl90 so I don't doubt that it's very difficult at minimum ilvl, but it's definitely doable. It just requires above average skill. It's a separate conversation whether that is a good thing or not.

[Charisma]

I'm unconvinced that helicanarssis in haukke Manor hard is beatable with minimum ilvl tbh.

You would wonder how much damage a low equipped character can do.
Most of time the dps you find in DF, deal like 70% of their real potency.

Also LB on last add, nullifies any DPS race

[Nestama]

I'm unconvinced that helicanarssis in haukke Manor hard is beatable with minimum ilvl tbh.

I once did HMHM with two fresh 50 DDs, a SMN and DRG. Halicarnassis took a few tries, but we managed to beat her just fine. Mind you, one wipe had the PLD leave (which was good. Despite their Animus status, they did NOT grab adds or assist in DPS on adds. Replacement PLD was much better and allowed me to easily Cleric Dance).

Sure, that's two ilvl90+ players and two ilvl49-52 players, but still. We beat her with maybe 10 seconds left before her enrage
Also, our first PLD was trying to force a speed run (pulling ALL the mobs), which took longer than killing mobs one group at a time. A lot of wipes were caused by that Animus PLD, now that I think about it.

[Synestr]

Slightly back on topic...

As an ex-LoTRO player I would second the dungeon suggestion, mainly the part about the different tiers of difficulty. Regular mode is what we have now for HM. Then actual "Hard Mode" would include a challenge, with specific criteria met, tougher trash and bosses. If you miss an objective in the Challenge you loose out on the extra special chest at the end boss. Still get actual HM loot but not that extra chest. Regular could keep the crafting mat parade that is currently in place, HM would have i85-i90 and the challenge chest would have a 2% drop reate for oil/sands/UAT and 65% rate for i95 gear (weapon, accessory, armor) and a 33% rate for an i100 piece.

I think that wold be fun. Can work in tome rewards and what not.

But I think this would be something neat to see.

/discuss...flaws - benefits -etc

Syn

[Sassi666]

snip for character limit.

Damage negation is only one part. If the tank uses Lb good luck getting Amandine down. The main thing is the dps check on each add and if you don't finish the fight in time it's a wipe as she sucks in a player and one hits the party. At ilvl 48 this would be next to impossible. My friend and I were ilvl 70 with 70 weapons the first time we did this and the tank wanted to kick us as he said we wouldn't have enough dps. We killed her first go but reading strategy before I went in many people said you just couldn't get the dps at the mo ilvl. Anyway sorry for derailing the thread.

[Staris]

Yes lets mimic more Free - play games

This is almost the same as people who want to mimic 1.0

... That game did so well.

[Kaonis]

I can get on board with a change. As it stands dungeons serve no purpose. They are pretty much designed for a fresh 50, but have crap for rewards (gl getting loot when the loot tables are so massive). If there wasn't a daily for them I would literally never run any of these dungeons after day 1 because they serve no purpose. They are laughably easy (their ilvl requirements are so insanely low), their rewards are purely for vanity (and as I said on a massive loot table, I STILL haven't seen some things drop from dozens if not over 100+ runs during the myth farming days).

Regardless of what people thinks need to be done, dungeons need an over haul as they are just a waste of space and time as it stands.

[Rainsworth]

I can get on board with a change. As it stands dungeons serve no purpose. They are pretty much designed for a fresh 50, but have crap for rewards (gl getting loot when the loot tables are so massive). If there wasn't a daily for them I would literally never run any of these dungeons after day 1 because they serve no purpose. They are laughably easy (their ilvl requirements are so insanely low), their rewards are purely for vanity (and as I said on a massive loot table, I STILL haven't seen some things drop from dozens if not over 100+ runs during the myth farming days).

Regardless of what people thinks need to be done, dungeons need an over haul as they are just a waste of space and time as it stands.

Dungeons are there to prepare you for ex primals/coil. They are serving that purpose just fine. It's true that you can get tomes by hunting marks but unless your server is not filled with greedy people, it may not be the best option.