Of PvP & Protect Spell

[Fainto]

Does this mean that "Blood for Blood" doesnt increase damage taken by 25% then also?

No, but it seems like you're missing the nuance in the wording here. Spells and abilities that say "damage taken" will still work the exact same way they do in PvE.

Some examples of spells that do work (Damage Taken):

• Blood for Blood
• Vengeance
• Rampart
• Sentinel

Some examples of spells that don't work (Physical or Magical Defense):

• Protect
• Foresight
• Fey Covenant

As for raising the magic defense of Dragoons, that is mostly a PvE change... The issue there is that DRG armour has much lower magic defense than everyone else on their gear and are therefore more likely to die to unavoidable aoe magic damage (such as the primal ultimates and megaflare in T9).

[Logo]

No, but it seems like you're missing the nuance in the wording here. Spells and abilities that say "damage taken" will still work the exact same way they do in PvE.

Some examples of spells that do work (Damage Taken):

• Blood for Blood
• Vengeance
• Rampart
• Sentinel

Some examples of spells that don't work (Physical or Magical Defense):

• Protect
• Foresight
• Fey Covenant

Gotcha! makes sense now!

[Buff_Archer]

I can name for sure one situation in which Protect doesn't work in Frontlines- when people can't wait 1 damn second longer for it to finish casting on them before they do Mount and charge off to die again solo. I'm getting sick of dismounting two or three times in a row for players who res behind me maybe 10 seconds behind each other, and as soon as they're up I'll cast Prot...->Mount! they're gone. Another one rises so I get off my mount to cast Protec.... ->Mount! they're off just before it finished, so they can get back to the scene of the battle where their teammates are dead or dying and somehow single-handedly turn the tide. I'm not referring to Alliance members since I can't cast Protect on them and they would know that.

One follow-up (before anyone else responds if I can type this fast enough)- if Protect really doesn't work they should have done a better job communicating that so none of us are wasting our time with it.

[Vandril]

Paladin is a counter class to melee. DEF is eliminated, thus def increasing skills become obsolete other than to act as a buff filter. Percent reduc skills like sentinel still have effect as they reduce damage by a flat out %. This makes paladins very strong in 1 on 1.

This is true. In most 1v1 fights, I am taking an average of about 25% (totally guestimated) less damage than my enemy solely due to CDs, now that I think about it. And that would explain the gap I'm seeing.

Honestly, I don't know how you people can pvp and not notice these things. Think of the logistics of what would happen if def was enabled. Ever notice how dungeon mobs can 1/2 shot most classes, but the tank classes can take multiple of them on without needing cooldowns? Because their def/mdef is at least double. IF def was enabled tanks would be sooo hard to kill in comparison with regular classes, much like in pve. In fl/wd they are sturdier due to their defensive cooldowns and larger HP pool. But they still die pretty quickly too.

Well, in my case, I didn't notice because I go out of my way to hit anything except tanks. I always assumed Def/MDef worked in FL since Morale wasn't in effect, so I avoided hitting tanks if there was any other target nearby. And I don't much pay attention to the numbers my abilities deal in damage. I focus mainly on my enemy's health bar and go by percentages, when I'm trying to determine my damage. I could turn my floating combat text off and not notice the difference.

All in all, this revelation won't change much in how I play Frontlines. At most, it'll make me not bother using Protect after dying, unless I think it'll be worth using to soak a dispel. Tanks are still more tanky, DPS still do more damage, and Healers are still going to die by my Shield Bash Spa-er, I mean hand. So, yeah, not much has changed.

[Divinemight]

Update on this issue. It is confirmed that defense values does not work in the Frontline is working as intended:

こんばんは。

フロントラインでは、ウルヴズジェイル同様に物理防御力／魔法防御力は無効にしており、
その前提でバトルのバランスも調整しています。

そのためフォーサイトやプロテスのような物理防御力をのばすアクションも効果はありません。

The god damn morale has ruined a lot of thing. They are balance the Frontline based on the framework of Wolf Den where defense values doesnt work because of morale. Protect, Foresight, and Fey Covenant doesnt work because of the stupid Morale?

[Gor]

Update on this issue. It is confirmed that defense values does not work in the Frontline is working as intended:



The god damn morale has ruined a lot of thing. They are balance the Frontline based on the framework of Wolf Den where defense values doesnt work because of morale. Protect, Foresight, and Fey Covenant doesnt work because of the stupid Morale?

Lame. Then I retract my earlier statement ... its still useful tho for buff munchers and I'll still cast it on my party members. Still no reason not to tho. Altho it does kind of suck, players have learned to adapt to the minus morale environment even if the Protect icon is just a placebo

[Vandril]

Lame. Then I retract my earlier statement ... its still useful tho for buff munchers and I'll still cast it on my party members. Still no reason not to tho. Altho it does kind of suck, players have learned to adapt to the minus morale environment even if the Protect icon is just a placebo

And a placebo it is, because I was totally convinced that it worked. XD

[Gor]

And a placebo it is, because I was totally convinced that it worked. XD

Me too! I guess the bright side is I can now use that Prot slot for another more useful cross skill in 30s arenas

[Buff_Archer]

They need to tell us ASAP which skills have no use in Frontlines and which don't indicate as such in their tool tips so we don't waste our time using them. And if there's no use for Protect, that's one cross-class skill wasted on my Scholar in Frontlines and I could swap in another. It sounds like galvanize would still work, and same with stoneskin, based on the above, but they need to make the rules absolutely clear because without them we can't formulate the best strategies vs. those who happen to know. As a console user, crossbar space on our primary and secondary backup crossbars is at a premium- I already have macros to swap out PVP vs PVE crossbar loadouts- and if using something as fundamental as an action or pet action is meaningless I might as well put a situational macro or something in its place. If they could simply post a list for now that would be something.

[Gor]

They need to tell us ASAP which skills have no use in Frontlines and which don't indicate as such in their tool tips so we don't waste our time using them.

This has already been requested on the REQUEST LIST: Short Term and Long Term PvP thread http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-Long-Term-PvP . Whether SE actually implements it or not, is up to them. Keep your fingers crossed.

Adjustments to PvP equipment to be usable. More specifically, giving Morale some sort of purpose. Also, implement a better way to display which stats are currently disabled for users to easily see. One possible suggestion - Display all disabled stats in Frontlines in red on the character stat windows, with a note in their mouseover tooltips explaining that they are disabled. (Thanks to Vandril for idea)