I hope this clears up some of the Rogue>Ninja rage

[Roll]

Here's the reason why I think that SE went with the Rogue>Thief route:

*Classes are the odd unconventional classes that Tanaka came up with to be different from the traditional FF jobs. (in 1.0, CNJ had 6 elemental tier spells plus Cure, Protect, etc. and THM had Banish(Astral/Light), Scourge(Umbral/Dark), and a bunch of enfeeble/dot spells and even an overpowered Cure+Regen spell.

*Jobs are the traditional jobs from FF that Yoshi-P wanted to bring back to make FFXIV have the FF feel again since Tanaka strayed far from it. Due to this, he had to make the original classes start to fit the role of their respective jobs. That's when the big changes to spells/skills took place. (THM got the traditional BLM spells like Fire, Blizzard, Thunder; CNJ kept Cure, Protect and Raise etc.)

Yes Thief is one of the classic six FF jobs but due to the class/job format, Yoshi-P had to rename it Rogue.

So...
*Thief>Ninja=X Why? Because Thief is a traditional job so renaming Thief to an unconventional class keeps up with the same format above.
*Rogue>Ninja and Thief=X Why? Adding two DPS jobs from the same class wouldn't really work since the DPS>Tank/Healer ratio is already high. DPS already have long queue times because of this as well...
*Rogue>Ninja=O Why? Rogue is basically Thief but due to the class/job format it had to be renamed. Also, people keep forgetting that waaay back in FF1, Thief TURNS INTO a Ninja so this is nothing new.

"But I wanna be a Thief! I don't want to use Ninjutsu and be a Ninja!"
*A big percentage of people who played Thief in FFXI subbed Ninja as their secondary jobs to have access to Utsusemi: Ichi/Ni and Dual Wield (Before SE naturally gave Thief Dual Wield) so it's probably going to be something similar like 17 traditional Thief skills from Rogue, and 5 Ninjutsu skills from Ninja. Also, you can always just glamour your gear to look like the green Rogue/Thief gear from the trailer.

Basically Yoshi-P had to recreate the game while still keeping the lore of the classes intact. So in order to do that, the traditional jobs had to be introduced as an evolution to classes.

Anyway, I hope all this would help people have a better understanding as to why SE went with this route. Yeah I was hoping Thief would be a job too but after digging through FF history and lore, I realize and understand why they did what they had to do and the pieces came together just fine in my opinion. ._.

[Mugiawara]

Thief just sounds better to me lol.

[Roll]

Thief just sounds better to me lol.

Yeah I know how you feel... Even back in 1.0 when we just had CNJ and THM, I wanted one of them to be called White Mage and Black Mage and not some weird hybrid dps/heal class lol

[Codek]

From what I recall from the live letters, the main reason they named it Rogue was simply because they thought it wouldn't make any sense to have a "Thief" guild within a major city. What leader would go on and say "uh yep, I think having a bunch of thieves running around would make a great addition towards my society"?

[Roll]

From what I recall from the live letters, the main reason they named it Rogue was simply because they thought it wouldn't make any sense to have a "Thief" guild within a major city. What leader would go on and say "uh yep, I think having a bunch of thieves running around would make a great addition towards my society"?

I don't think Rogue's Guild would be any better.
According to the definition:
rogue
rōg/Submit
noun
1. a dishonest or unprincipled man.
"you are a rogue and an embezzler"
synonyms: scoundrel, villain, miscreant, reprobate, rascal, good-for-nothing, ne'er-do-well, wretch; informalrat, dog, louse, crook; datedcad; archaicblackguard, picaroon, knave
"a rogue without ethics"

[Roll]

Maybe the Rogue's Guild will be hidden in a back alley or something kept secret away from the public's knowledge lol.

[IndigoHawk]

From what I recall from the live letters, the main reason they named it Rogue was simply because they thought it wouldn't make any sense to have a "Thief" guild within a major city. What leader would go on and say "uh yep, I think having a bunch of thieves running around would make a great addition towards my society"?

A Thieves guild would be perfectly fine in either Limsa Lominsa (which openly has pirates, who are basically thieves and murderers on the ocean) or Ul'dah (this city is corrupt and greedy enough to want an official headquarters for organized crime ... so that the Ul'dah nobles can get a cut of the profits and make sure crime is neither too high/unsafe nor too low/unprofitable).

[TheRogueX]

From what I recall from the live letters, the main reason they named it Rogue was simply because they thought it wouldn't make any sense to have a "Thief" guild within a major city. What leader would go on and say "uh yep, I think having a bunch of thieves running around would make a great addition towards my society"?

Which is absolutely stupid, because why would the Thieve's Guild need or want to be accepted by the leadership of a major city? In what setting has it ever been the case that a city welcomed its Thieve's Guild? Yoshi's explanation was patently ridiculous and shows that he doesn't really get it when it comes to Thieve's Guilds. The guild wouldn't have a bright, flashy sign saying 'HEY HERE WE ARE COME TRAIN TO STEAL STUFF;' instead you'd use some form of non-verbal communication in a seedy pub and make your way into a secret back room where all the guild work took place.

Also, what leadership would have a problem with a thieve's guild WHILE STILL ALLOWING SOMETHING LIKE THE SYNDICATE TO EXIST.

"Oh, Ul'dah couldn't allow a thieve's guild, but sure, your criminal organization that regularly kidnaps people, murders people, and commits rampant amounts of violent crime is perfectly allowed within our city! Here, have a seat on our council!"

I agree that Uldah would be the place for a thieves\assassins guild and it would be a secret organization.

I would totally be into this. Not just a second job forked off of Rogue, but as its own class. Assassin could be the job. Hmm. Sorta like a dark reflection of Rogue/Ninja. Lore-wise it doesn't have to be incompatible.

[Drasyra]

I shall be glamouring mine to look like Locke Cole, so I am perfectly happy not to be called a thief. Call me a treasure hunter!

[Souljacker]

You are misinterpreting the reason for the rage. We *understand* what Yoshi-P's reasoning is, we just disagree that he *needs* to keep this whole Class -> Job thing going on. It is practically useless as it is right now. I have done to cap 4 jobs now, and not once have I felt the need to take the soul crystal off on any of those jobs. What is the point of the classes again? It's not even like I could switch back to Conjurer from White Mage and be a decent DPS. I can't switch from Warrior to Maurauder and DPS. I can't switch from Dragoon to Lancer and be a tank... At some point the whole system including the Armory system WILL need to be redone from the ground up. It's too... just limiting in its current incarnation. Tying a job to a weapon you are holding instead of just letting us say "I want to play as my Warrior today", making that change and having access to a wide variety of weaponry the class can use was a foolish idea.

But SE will defend their vision for as long as they can until it becomes apparent that their ability to bring new and interesting jobs is stifled because of it.


And please rethink Rogue, or at least hold a class on how to spell it as a public service.