Simplicity over complexity, time to change.

[Zantetsuken]

I understand for newcomers to the genre or even just to the IP it seems spectacular, a non linear RPG with an open world and good story with a real challenge near the end. But id say it takes at least a few years playing MMOs to understand what makes them truly great. Anyone new to the MMO genre I think looks at the game as it currently is and judges it whereas veteran MMO players look at where it is going and that's the big difference. Most of us, casual and hardcore alike love what they have done for the most part. What scares us is where it is heading and if they can redirect the currently grim future we see. That is my opinion at least.

Hit the nail on the head.

Newer players to MMO games will likely draw from their experiences playing FPS games, or GTA, or Dragon Age, or Skyrim, etc.. and they will evaluate a MMO based on that criteria. But other online games (and offline RPGs) are designed to be picked up, played for maybe 5 months and then abandoned for when the next big game comes along.

A Veteran MMO gamer knows that the experience of the game is stretched out over years, and if crafted properly, it leaves players with some of the best gaming experiences to be found anywhere.

[Fendred]

Hit the nail on the head.

Newer players to MMO games will likely draw from their experiences playing FPS games, or GTA, or Dragon Age, or Skyrim, etc.. and they will evaluate a MMO based on that criteria. But other online games (and offline RPGs) are designed to be picked up, played for maybe 5 months and then abandoned for when the next big game comes along.

But that is one of the problems MMOs have been facing: They do NOT look at what other games outside the genre are doing that could be useful for them. It is an MMORPG, remember? An RPG! There has been a lot done in that genre and I've rarely seen any of it taken into the MMO space! Plus, they are copying and pasting generic MMORPG features into their game without proper consideration of the mood or theme of the game (and also the fact that the game is balanced around PvE).

[Zarzak]

Hit the nail on the head.

Newer players to MMO games will likely draw from their experiences playing FPS games, or GTA, or Dragon Age, or Skyrim, etc.. and they will evaluate a MMO based on that criteria. But other online games (and offline RPGs) are designed to be picked up, played for maybe 5 months and then abandoned for when the next big game comes along.

A Veteran MMO gamer knows that the experience of the game is stretched out over years, and if crafted properly, it leaves players with some of the best gaming experiences to be found anywhere.

Best. Statement. Ever.

[Fendred]

The problems with the game are not stemming from simplicity, but rather the fact that the metagame is all about leveling up various classes when the end game philosophy is taken straight out of your typical themepark MMORPG where people play only one class. It's been said many times going all the way back to the release of 2.0 that end game needs a very different philosophy to make full use of the game's initial assets. Very few people play "just warrior" or "just paladin" because the depth of the game comes from playing multiple classes. So for most players to play the way they want they'd have to engage in two, maybe three times the grind that Yoshida has designed the game around. That simply isn't fun, and requires an impossible time commitment.

Actually, a lot of the problems come from shoehorning generic MMORPG features into the game. Even the PvP is lackluster due to that. It feels like each patch just sucks a little bit more of the game's soul right out of it.

[Chasely]

The problems with the game are not stemming from simplicity, but rather the fact that the metagame is all about leveling up various classes when the end game philosophy is taken straight out of your typical themepark MMORPG where people play only one class. It's been said many times going all the way back to the release of 2.0 that end game needs a very different philosophy to make full use of the game's initial assets. Very few people play "just warrior" or "just paladin" because the depth of the game comes from playing multiple classes. So for most players to play the way they want they'd have to engage in two, maybe three times the grind that Yoshida has designed the game around. That simply isn't fun, and requires an impossible time commitment.

Actually, a lot of the problems come from shoehorning generic MMORPG features into the game. Even the PvP is lackluster due to that. It feels like each patch just sucks a little bit more of the game's soul right out of it.

Completely agree.

[Fendred]

Completely agree.

Speaking of sucking the soul out of things, I should get back to necromantically sucking the souls out of other living creatures via fates so I can make my +5 curtana of love and peace. Toodles!

<- Is a warrior of light! XD

[Xairos]

The problems with the game are not stemming from simplicity, but rather the fact that the metagame is all about leveling up various classes when the end game philosophy is taken straight out of your typical themepark MMORPG where people play only one class. It's been said many times going all the way back to the release of 2.0 that end game needs a very different philosophy to make full use of the game's initial assets. Very few people play "just warrior" or "just paladin" because the depth of the game comes from playing multiple classes. So for most players to play the way they want they'd have to engage in two, maybe three times the grind that Yoshida has designed the game around. That simply isn't fun, and requires an impossible time commitment.

Actually, a lot of the problems come from shoehorning generic MMORPG features into the game. Even the PvP is lackluster due to that. It feels like each patch just sucks a little bit more of the game's soul right out of it.

I dont think SE, per se, will gamble on another mmo like they did with FFXI and 1.2X until FFXVII: Online. But that's only if FFXIV is long-term profitable. But the bad thing is if FFXIV is profitable, then they might just copy what they did then. ; ;

[rwyan]

I think part of the problem is that MMOs have become built around progression of some sort. We're lead through what often times amount to a un-engaging trek to the endgame which is often times revolves around gearscore, instances, etc... Older MMOs, while progression was important, it was usually a side effect of simply engaging with other players. Yes, sometimes getting that next level would be a motivation, but what kept me logging in were the social bonds and camaraderie that occurred playing with either guild mates or even players you were pugging with for the night. Of course, these MMOs had their own design flaws and unnecessary time sinks but there was also a strong sense of mystery, immersion, fear, etc...

The reason some players have a strong feel for the original 1.x version of FF14 is that it was intended to harken back to a lot of older MMO principles while streamlining the unnecessary bits. Unfortunately, it launched half-baked. There are a lot of things I miss from 1.0. There are also a lot of things I don't miss. I do prefer the original direction of FF14. However, Yoshida has typically provided a polished and very playable MMO (no game is without its hiccups).

Unfortunately, I do worry about the future of FF14. In its current form, I do enjoy it. However, with a growing reliance on things like currencies, gear grinds, lockout timers, I'm afraid that it will just become a game with a variety of "okay" activities that are tied together through currencies as opposed to a variety of engaging, fun, and challenging activities that provide a wealth of goals and achievements to attain. I think that is why many look back to FFXI. Yes, it could be time consuming at times, but it featured a variety of types of content. Some players found a niche in a subset of that content. Some enjoyed all of it.

[Kazama]

Older MMOs, while progression was important, it was usually a side effect of simply engaging with other players. Yes, sometimes getting that next level would be a motivation, but what kept me logging in were the social bonds and camaraderie that occurred playing with either guild mates or even players you were pugging with for the night.

Well, you see the length of time getting from beginning to end game is what supported that camaraderie. When you spent 3 weeks in one zone to gain 13 levels you had no choice but to meet those players. And, their experience over those 3 weeks directly related to yours in a sense. There was significantly more culture building in early MMOs as we often weren't able to access new content for weeks at a time so we spent it together on that journey. I hate to sound like a geezer but back in those days we had to create our own entertainment because it wasn't shoved down our throat every second. Instead it was there as the fruit at the top of the tree we were climbing and so much sweeter.

I think that is why many look back to FFXI. Yes, it could be time consuming at times, but it featured a variety of types of content. Some players found a niche in a subset of that content. Some enjoyed all of it.

That's a great point. I personally entertained myself for months doing things people never really did. I'd farm memories and beast seals while level capped in the Crag of Dem for a shot to solo BCNMS on BLM, often times having to go rescue parties doing their Promyvions. I spent tons of time running around to strange apparatus and depositing chips in the hopes for Arcane Pots to grow more Elemental Ore. I'd farm low level NMs that didn't get camped and because the world was so massive and there were so many of them I spent a lot of time traveling and sightseeing.

[Barimu]

What I don't like about 14 is there is no danger except in coils and coils are completed in a day and you're done for the week. Where's the fun in that? Another thing is this game doesn't promote any type of socializing or sense of a community. The lack of open world danger is really depressing. MMO's are meant to be interactive with the world itself and the people around it. I personally feel like 14 oppresses interaction because you don't really need to interact with other people to do things. CT? you can afk every fight. Coils is the only thing you really need to interact with people for in end game and like I said one day you're in and out and have nothing left to do for the week. Another thing is the free gear and handouts in this game. The ability to receive end game raid gear through trivial things in this game is horrible and should not be continued.