"You are bad at using Provoke"

[RhazeCain]

Yep, Provoke probably the most misunderstood ability in game. Or at minimum the most misunderstood tank ability.

Provoke gives you slightly more agro than the person currently at top of agro list. And I do emphasize the slightly part. Like +1 point, which ends up being ~0.0001%. So any activity at all done by the person 2nd on agro list puts them to 1st (i.e., person using Provoke loses agro right after).

Want to pull at very long range - longer than Tomahawk/Shield Lob? Cool. Use Provoke.
Want to pull 1 mob with GCD ability, and another before GCD finishes? Cool. Use Provoke for one of them.
Want to grab hate of a mob that's attacking your party member? Cool. Use Provoke followed quickly by another ability (Tomahawk/Shield Lob possibly).

Anything else - like using Provoke when Tomahawk/Shield Lob would work, or when you already have top agro spot - is just useless waste of the Provoke skill.

Having a thread like this trending on the forums might help. At least for that faction of players that actually reads here.

[Valmar]

Forget I said Anything.

Everything is taken to litterial on these forums anyway.

Yes In WoW, Taunt forces the Mob to attack you for something like 6 seconds, in which you have that much time to take Aggro, else it goes back to whatever the Mob was doing.

What I meant was in FFXIV when you Provoke something it places you 1 Aggro Above the highest person on the Mob's threat List, Thus bringing the Mob to you, for a Few Seconds, maybe 2 GCDs and that is the time you have to Take Hate.

I understand Reading inbetween the lines isnt a thing on the FFXIV Forums, but damn such Litterial Nazi's in this thread.

[Delorean]

from what I remember I died at one point and when revived I tried to provoke the King and didn't get full enmity for it, I went from 8th in the agro list to about 4th or 5th. So I'm wondering is there an upper limit to how much aggro provoke can give you.

Was it a coordinated group? Because it's very possible that the player just unloaded a huge amount of enmity at the time that you had casted Provoke. Warriors, particularly, can generate an exorbitant amount of enmity off of a single Skull Sunder or Butcher's Block while under the effects of Berserk and Unchained.

I understand Reading inbetween the lines isnt a thing on the FFXIV Forums, but damn such Litterial Nazi's in this thread.

they are just trying to make sure that the information in the discussion is accurate

[randomrope]

I believe it would be easier if we were to think of a way of telling people how Provoke works in a simple way that can be understand by almost (some people will never learn, but heh...) anyone using it, all of that in the middle of a dungeon.

So, please, how would you explain it?

I like how you bring this topic up without giving any constructive advice. As a competent tank there are only 2 instances when you should use provoke:
1. When doing a tank swap.
2. When trying to grab something out of range of tomahawk/shield lob without wanting to move.

If you are not in either of those situations you don't have a true need to provoke. Otherwise stop tanking. I say this because if you need to have provoke explained, again, stop tanking.

[Kuwagami]

What I meant was in FFXIV when you Provoke something it places you 1 Aggro Above the highest person on the Mob's threat List, Thus bringing the Mob to you, for a Few Seconds, maybe 2 GCDs and that is the time you have to Take Hate.

I understand Reading inbetween the lines isnt a thing on the FFXIV Forums, but damn such Litterial Nazi's in this thread.

That said, after using provoke you generally have less than a GCD to stabilize hate. You're nowhere near a few seconds, unless your group is very well coordinated

stuff

3) when you died

You shouldn't forget this one, you can always meet bad healers

[randomrope]

3) when you died

You shouldn't forget this one, you can always meet bad healers

I am sorry but you are wrong. You have to actually be on the hate table for provoke to work. For all of you using provoke first after you die you are wasting it. That is why you are confused when you provoke first after death and you are either not on the table or in the middle (because you quickly use something else after it).

You must get on the enmity table FIRST by using another action. Then use provoke followed by another hate generating action. Nice try Kuwagami.

Example: Tomahawk/Shield lob (cause you are running back to the mob) > Provoke > Tomahawk/shield lob or start your hate combo.

[Kuwagami]

I am sorry but you are wrong. You have to actually be on the hate table for provoke to work. For all of you using provoke first after you die you are wasting it. That is why you are confused when you provoke first after death and you are either not on the table or in the middle (because you quickly use something else after it).

You must get on the enmity table FIRST by using another action. Then use provoke followed by another hate generating action. Nice try Kuwagami.

Example: Tomahawk/Shield lob (cause you are running back to the mob) > Provoke > Tomahawk/shield lob or start your hate combo.

weren't we talking about boss fights here ? For trash if you die there's no way to recover in time, all trash will be cleared or the group will wipe (or the healer will choose you over saving a dps/himself..)

In a boss fight, you get on hate table as soon as you set foot in the battle space, be it entering the room or being revived.

I don't know what your experience is, but reviving => defiance => provoke works 100% of the time

(inb4 "you used a buff and gained 70 points" : nope, you gain no enmity with buffs if you are far from the target (further than a tomahawk at least, which is almost always the case)

EDIT : thinking of it again, you're totally wrong on that. Just randomly provoke a mob in the wild and you'll see. If it doesn't work, they ninja changed it a few days ago.
The only moment provoke doesn't work is for FATEs and hunt (until you generated some enmity for hunts to prevent abuses)

[subteraneanbird]

I don't use provoke. If I lose hate, I just get up and make a sandwich. Haven't eaten in months.

"I don't do any fights starting with Ultima HM and higher because those need tank swaps."

[randomrope]

In a boss fight, you get on hate table as soon as you set foot in the battle space, be it entering the room or being revived.

Nope. Thats the same as orange aggro. Of course if you stand there and do nothing the boss will eventually come to you cause you are the last one left. Im talking about the hate table. Its when you actually get some white on the aggro bar.

I don't know what your experience is, but reviving => defiance => provoke works 100% of the time

EDIT : thinking of it again, you're totally wrong on that. Just randomly provoke a mob in the wild and you'll see. If it doesn't work, they ninja changed it a few days ago.
The only moment provoke doesn't work is for FATEs and hunt (until you generated some enmity for hunts to prevent abuses)

No shit that will work on a mob in the wild. Its an action against it. Aggro and being on the enmity table are two different things.

[randomrope]

The only moment provoke doesn't work is for FATEs and hunt (until you generated some enmity for hunts to prevent abuses)

And wow. How would it work in a FATE when provoke does nothing against ppl not in your pt. Learn the actions before you try to argue with someone about it.