The new seek invite function

[Nipa]

It's not subjective

Uh? I am only saying that usability is subjective. If someone is used to an interface style, he will be able to use an interface of the same kind very quickly. If he encounters an new kind of interface, he may find difficult to use it. And some people will have more difficulty to adapt than others.

and the only reason documentation is needed is because people can't figure out something as obvious as a +/- button and drop-down lists :S

A drop-down list is not obvious, for something that could be done with a check box. You don't have all the informations on the screen at all time, this requires you to fiddle with the interface a bit to understand how it works. For some people, this is difficult. For other, it's a bother. Those people will rather spam in the local shout for a party.

Check boxes, radio-buttons, text-aeras are obvious, because everything is on-screen at once. Dropdown lists, +/- systems, menus, are less obvious (and it's no binary, a text-based interface a la "/pcmd add" is even less obvious).

And again, having to read a documentation to play a game is crazy. For some people this is the exact opposite of everything a game means.

[SuzakuCMX]

And again, having to read a documentation to play a game is crazy. For some people this is the exact opposite of everything a game means.

Welcome to RPGs? Especially Square Enix RPGs.

A drop-down list is not obvious, for something that could be done with a check box. You don't have all the informations on the screen at all time, this requires you to fiddle with the interface a bit to understand how it works. For some people, this is difficult. For other, it's a bother. Those people will rather spam in the local shout for a party.

It is pretty obvious. They have the downward arrows next to them, and it says what the field is. Check boxes would clutter the screen so much, and it's impossible to use a check-box for Rank anyways.

Check boxes, radio-buttons, text-aeras are obvious, because everything is on-screen at once. Dropdown lists, +/- systems, menus, are less obvious (and it's no binary, a text-based interface a la "/pcmd add" is even less obvious).

Radio button wouldn't really do much. Classes pretty much have set roles. You don't expect a GLA or MRD to do more than Tank/DPS, which they can do at the same time, so having a radio button for that would be redundant. CON who wants to nuke would never be invited to a dungeon party because they are the only class capable of AoE-healing.

Agree on the /party cmd thing, needs to be fixed. However that isn't something that has to do with the party search interface.

Uh? I am only saying that usability is subjective. If someone is used to an interface style, he will be able to use an interface of the same kind very quickly. If he encounters an new kind of interface, he may find difficult to use it. And some people will have more difficulty to adapt than others.

Usability is not subjective. The amount of it is, but you can't say "this is unusable" as a general statement if other players can use it just fine. The intuitiveness of an interface is a different story, however, and the entire interface of FFXIV is unintuitive if you've never played FFXI before.

[Nipa]

Welcome to RPGs? Especially Square Enix RPGs.

I have played most of the old FF games without ever reading a manual, and I'm still alive. I most certainly misunderstood the effect of a lot of skills and missed a lot of secrets, yet I have had my share of fun and could finished them without difficulty.

I have yet to see a recent "mainstream" MMO where the average user had to read a external manual at some point. Of course, there is still the need to use external sources of information (you guild, general chats, wiki, forums), but only for advanced mechanisms (and I feel this is a part of the game). Having to use a manual to, say, invite another player or use a LFG tool seems wrong to me, as those are basic mechanisms.

It is pretty obvious. They have the downward arrows next to them, and it says what the field is. Check boxes would clutter the screen so much, and it's impossible to use a check-box for Rank anyways.

It could be, with a grid for instance: one row for each class you have (rank indicated) and a column for each role available (dps, heal, tank, maybe support). Wouldn't take a lot of space (we have 7 classes I think, and this would only show the actually played ones). You could even disable the roles a clan can't play (but that would be a bit of shame for the system diversity).

Also, I only listed radio buttons as an example of easier to use widgets. Whatever hides information on requires more clics, if it can be avoided, always increase the accessibility.

Usability is not subjective. The amount of it is, but you can't say "this is unusable" as a general statement if other players can use it just fine. The intuitiveness of an interface is a different story, however, and the entire interface of FFXIV is unintuitive if you've never played FFXI before.

I can use a command line interface, while my mother can't. By "can't" I mean, it would make her run away and scream (and I'm not even joking). For her, it's unusable while for me, it's usable. I really don't see why usability has to be an absolute value.

But if it's only the choice of wording that bother you, you can re-read all my posts subsisting 'usable' for, say, 'intuitive enough for the average MMO player' (someone else than your or me, that is to say), because this is really my point. We can have a LFG interface that anyone can use without any requirement, so why not ask for one? Or better, try to design one, as SE seems to have some problems with general accessibility.

Anyway, I don't think SE or anyone else is still reading us...