Thread: Did 2.3 create enmity issues for tanks?

I think I have finally ran into the issue last night while running with my SO healer; it never seemed to happen during any dungeons, but it did during a few fates. Mind you I didn't have defiance up, but she never use to surpass 60% of my hate output running SE > BB and she was riding my ass through the whole fight, haha.

I don't think the problem comes from the tank stance hate multiplier if I can view a sizable difference w/o defiance up though. Either way, I didn't see any patch notes regarding combo hate multipliers, so does that mean the infamous spaghetti coding SE is known for plagues FFXIV too? Haha

I have noticed the same issue while tanking SVHM.
Was with MNK and BLM who were well equipped at around 95-100, my PLD is close though at 91ilvl and I never had issues keeping hate in such party config unless monk was going all out on wrong moob before I had time to do 2-3 GCD skills.

Have to admit that I haven't tanked much for a while, so maybe was not doing 100%optimal, but PLD is so straight forward... Anyway, I usually flash -> CoS -> flash(sometimes 2x if BLM is strong) then start my 1st RoH combo on main target -> flash after the 1st combo to keep up the hate on secondary targets vs. healer/BLM.
It always worked fine and I was not loosing the hate on main target, nor other adds (had them fully on me so the flash after RoH was more for security reasons before building hate on them with standard combo than a must). Now after the patch I was very close to loosing the hate on main target to monk and on secondary targets for BLM when I was in the middle of my first combo.
The monk might have been exceptional but he didn't have at this point GLIII, BLM wasn't flaring, and yet I was for almost whole dung on the edge of loosing hate (lost it few times, too).
Other thing is that getting back the moob was a nightmare.

Last time I had such issues in dungeon as a tank was when I was fresh 50 and DDs were 20+ilvl above me. I don't mind fighting for hate and it might be fun up to some extend, but nothing I read about 2.3 indicates change in enmity (other than BLM single target potency increase which was not really applicable in this case).

Regards,
M

Originally Posted by Machetazzo

I have noticed the same issue while tanking SVHM.
Was with MNK and BLM who were well equipped at around 95-100, my PLD is close though at 91ilvl and I never had issues keeping hate in such party config unless monk was going all out on wrong moob before I had time to do 2-3 GCD skills.

Have to admit that I haven't tanked much for a while, so maybe was not doing 100%optimal, but PLD is so straight forward... Anyway, I usually flash -> CoS -> flash(sometimes 2x if BLM is strong) then start my 1st RoH combo on main target -> flash after the 1st combo to keep up the hate on secondary targets vs. healer/BLM.
It always worked fine and I was not loosing the hate on main target, nor other adds (had them fully on me so the flash after RoH was more for security reasons before building hate on them with standard combo than a must). Now after the patch I was very close to loosing the hate on main target to monk and on secondary targets for BLM when I was in the middle of my first combo.
The monk might have been exceptional but he didn't have at this point GLIII, BLM wasn't flaring, and yet I was for almost whole dung on the edge of loosing hate (lost it few times, too).
Other thing is that getting back the moob was a nightmare.

Last time I had such issues in dungeon as a tank was when I was fresh 50 and DDs were 20+ilvl above me. I don't mind fighting for hate and it might be fun up to some extend, but nothing I read about 2.3 indicates change in enmity (other than BLM single target potency increase which was not really applicable in this case).

Regards,
M

This is exactly what i experienced, except for the part "i haven't tanked much in a while".

I haven't had any problems keeping hate since the patch. The few times I do lose hate it's my own fault. Even when I'm on another job and group with other tanks they seem to be doing fine as well.

I could see there being a bug with shield oath since there was that one bug where sword oath would keep the enmity boost when switching from shield oath, but I have yet to experience it.

Originally Posted by Enyeto

I just want Overpower to cost 80TP instead of 140TP. This game is really killing my style not being able to chain pull groups.

You don't need to spam Overpower 'till you're out of TP to hold group hate, unless you're being completely out-geared by your party members. At your level, you should only need several or so per group of 3-4; Overpower > (Heavy Swing > Maim) > Overpower (x2) > (Heavy Swing > Skull Sunder) > (Heavy Swing > Maim) > Overpower (x2 if necessary) > continue single target combos.

Overpower's hate gen. is often underestimated and many think they just need to spam it when they lose enemies to people focusing an enemy the tank is not. There are a few ways to combat this; the simplest is to mark the focus target of the group (no need to mark them all as it can just complicate things), another option is to do all the grunt work yourself and continually change your focused target to which ever are being focused by the dps (this option will be harder at your level since you do not yet have access to your enmity combo finisher, Butcher's Block). I don't normally mark, but I run with static players most of the time; I tend to tab through targets to gauge my enmity lead after an initial AE burst, from there [single target] focus down enemies and weave in another Overpower if necessary. The only time Overpower spam may be necessary is during large group pulls of speed runs, but you have time to recover TP between those pulls.

Hmm.. Haven't noticed issues on either tank after the patch.. BEFORE the patch I started noticing some DPS getting extremely close in some fights on PLD, but I recently upgraded from Curtana Zenith to Weathered Burtgang and haven't had any issues since.

I also re-spec'd WAR to 30 strength a while back. I be stealing all the hate with him... Provoke? What? It's called Berserk and Unchained xD

If it's not buggin', probably just DPS creeping up on enmity output. Though I know a few high geared Paladins that run certain content in Sword Oath without enmity problems.

I've had issues both as a war and as a pld with random threat lost. For no reason. And it's not like we don't know how to play it by the book.

After 3 BB combos, and then...the blm pulls hate? wtf...oh well, back to killing adds.

Seems to happen the most when threat is still getting established, so maybe something is not getting calculated fast enough.