Things that need to change for the better

[MeowyWowie]

I don't run away, and still avoid AoE. Your argument is no longer valid

[Physic]

I don't run away, and still avoid AoE. Your argument is no longer valid

what you are saying is true for this aoe, but there are some aoes that just do a straight up circle, i havent tested if you can stun every one of them with WS, but i somehow doubt it. I do know for a fact some monsters have aoe special status effects in a circle that you cant interupt with WS, so archer still has the advantage overall with highest dps, and highest ability to avoid non hate damage, not only that but they also have the highest hate control, and skills that lower hate, so they can dps more than other classes without pulling hate.

It still has the advantage in practically every respect of what a DD needs to be good.

probably still highest dps
highest threshold for dmg to turn the monster
most control over hate, (no AA, can completely stop attacking at anytime)
least likely to get hit by skills that some one without hate gets.
and most likely to be able to run away without dying (ranged attack shadow and quickstride combined with no stopping for weapon drawing/put away anymore)

if you think about what a DD needs, rng still got it all.

[MeowyWowie]

what you are saying is true for this aoe, but there are some aoes that just do a straight up circle, i havent tested if you can stun every one of them with WS, but i somehow doubt it. I do know for a fact some monsters have aoe special status effects in a circle that you cant interupt with WS, so archer still has the advantage overall with highest dps, and highest ability to avoid non hate damage, not only that but they also have the highest hate control, and skills that lower hate, so they can dps more than other classes without pulling hate.

It still has the advantage in practically every respect of what a DD needs to be good.

probably still highest dps
highest threshold for dmg to turn the monster
most control over hate, (no AA, can completely stop attacking at anytime)
least likely to get hit by skills that some one without hate gets.
and most likely to be able to run away without dying (ranged attack shadow and quickstride combined with no stopping for weapon drawing/put away anymore)

if you think about what a DD needs, rng still got it all.

If you're so stuck on ARC being OP and "the best DD," go level ARC and stop complaining. Seems you will argue with every piece of advice given. So yea, like others have said, have some cheese with your whine.

To those open to advice and suggestions, and willing to "break out of the mold" best of luck to you all. Don't be fooled into thinking the most obvious strategies are the "best" as some would have you believe. They're obviously just jealous of those who don't play follow the leader.

[Raze]

If you're so stuck on ARC being OP and "the best DD," go level ARC and stop complaining. Seems you will argue with every piece of advice given. So yea, like others have said, have some cheese with your whine.

To those open to advice and suggestions, and willing to "break out of the mold" best of luck to you all. Don't be fooled into thinking the most obvious strategies are the "best" as some would have you believe. They're obviously just jealous of those who don't play follow the leader.

^this

Meowy and his group of ragtag misfits didn't like the idea of their jobs being deemed less useful so they actually went out and did something about it. If you love ARC so much, do something about it and join the ARC50 legion.

[Rogue]

you completely missed my point

[Mihana]

All I'm gonna say in this thread is that at first I was totally against the MP costs. I still am, sort of... But it's brought alot more interest to my love of playing a healing class. And if you have a skilled tank you can really get going! Even if my CON is only 30 I was able to manage my MP pool effectively, including hate by using Spiritbind and Soughspeak (sp?) while curing only as needed. I've got a bit of work to do, yes... But I think overall if you pay far more attention it's very possible to survive under these new conditions.

But I agree that MP costs should be slightly lowered, maybe by 1/4th to 1/3rd of what they are now, hate management I do believe is still being tweaked. So expect this to be improved upon likely by 1.19 patch. As for the R45 dungeon, I can't offer any info on this since I haven't tried it yet. I'm a little hesitant to since hearing how much trouble people have. But give it time maybe a week to month after it's been out and it'll get easier. One thing to remember is they did drastic changes to the combat engine and tweaked our MP costs and hate all in the same patch as these instanced raids were introduced. So we have to learn the battle style all over again and in the end it sort of weeds out the skilled players from the ones who just spammed attacks and grew lazy.

[Seirra_Lanzce]

All I'm gonna say in this thread is that at first I was totally against the MP costs. I still am, sort of... But it's brought alot more interest to my love of playing a healing class. And if you have a skilled tank you can really get going! Even if my CON is only 30 I was able to manage my MP pool effectively, including hate by using Spiritbind and Soughspeak (sp?) while curing only as needed. I've got a bit of work to do, yes... But I think overall if you pay far more attention it's very possible to survive under these new conditions.

But I agree that MP costs should be slightly lowered, maybe by 1/4th to 1/3rd of what they are now, hate management I do believe is still being tweaked. So expect this to be improved upon likely by 1.19 patch. As for the R45 dungeon, I can't offer any info on this since I haven't tried it yet. I'm a little hesitant to since hearing how much trouble people have. But give it time maybe a week to month after it's been out and it'll get easier. One thing to remember is they did drastic changes to the combat engine and tweaked our MP costs and hate all in the same patch as these instanced raids were introduced. So we have to learn the battle style all over again and in the end it sort of weeds out the skilled players from the ones who just spammed attacks and grew lazy.

This what OP should have posted instead of bitching about the patch. Think before post.

[Mortikhan]

My LS mates and I went through this last night for the first couple times. Was frustrating at first and needed to make some adjustments. I am not really the "avoid a fight and kite" type but we needed to in certain areas. Had somewhat the same result as Dubont with the Ogre though. The bogies were teleporting to the inner and outer rings constantly and tagging mages for 500+ from each one. It looks like a fight of positioning more than anything else (not really big on that either, reminds me of the Diablo fight from FFXI). I saw some indentations on the walls of the room so perhaps those will be safe havens for the mages not sure but we will definitely work on it more. We learned a lot from it overall and I thought the biggest factor was working against the clock. Our party set was CON THAUM GLADX2 PUG LNC ARCHX2. Was complete chaos the first time around but second was better and we reached the Ogre with far more time. We will see how it goes next time around.

[Thanos]

The update was awesome, but it had some severe bad sides and a few other things that need tweaking.

1) Cure MP costs. They are much too high and before anyone says "But 11's were high!" yeah, but a cure 3 wasn't 135MP

2) Raises need to be on separate timers. What's the point of having 4 different types of raises, as a CON, if we can only use 2?

3) Stats need enhancing. Aside from VIT and MND, they do next to nothing.

4) Gear damage from death needs to be abolished or reduced. Every dungeon run, I come out with at least 3 pieces of broken gear. This is unacceptable considering people want close to 10k to repair something...

5) the r45 dungeon needs a slight nerf. "CRY MOAR!" no seriously, the ogre opens up with AoE spam and the mages are usually dead in the first 30 seconds of the fight which leads to #6. Also, fix it so that if you wipe and have to return, that the mobs don't pop until you're team is inside the room. It is VERY hard to recover from a wipe on that fight as you will probably wipe again before your team is back into the fight (Stupid ghosts..)

6) Enmity needs to be fixed. The current system is severely flawed. A GLA used 3 vokes and a couple of WS on a mob, I cure 3'd once...mob turned around and bam, 1 shot.

Stop crying please. None of these points are valid. Enmity is fine the way it is.. Just cause u dont know how to hate manage as a mage is no ones fault. I dont have that issue.

Dungeons need not to be nerfed at all. You need to strategize. Its not hard at all to recover after a wipe when u run back...

Gear damage is fine.. get crafting.. cost less

MP cost is fine.. learntoMPmanage.com coordinate with other mages in the party

[Santrale]

Stop crying please. None of these points are valid. Enmity is fine the way it is.. Just cause u dont know how to hate manage as a mage is no ones fault. I dont have that issue.

Dungeons need not to be nerfed at all. You need to strategize. Its not hard at all to recover after a wipe when u run back...

Gear damage is fine.. get crafting.. cost less

MP cost is fine.. learntoMPmanage.com coordinate with other mages in the party

"Get crafting" What if you prefer adventuring with combat, and don't enjoy crafting? Why should anyone have to do something they hate to enjoy the things in the game they want to? Sounds like a wonderful time vampire to me. Then again you probably love the masochistic grind, and the idea of doing a bunch of things you're not interested in just to be efficient in what you are interested in. Do you also friendlist people just because they have jobs that may help you in something, and not because you actually enjoyed playing with the person? I mean that instance stuff is fine how it is for the hard core people that enjoy never getting off a game or the real world outside. But they shouldn't make things like gear wear and tear so ridiculous to fix without grinding on a craft for a good long while, or without kissing up to a crafter, so they can use them for their skills to repair when ever they need. Keep all casual play equally beneficial to hard core play. Including rewards SP gear whatever... I mean yeah it's great to have an awesome piece of gear. But why should people who don't have to leave the house get to rub others noses in the dirt because they have jobs or a life in the real world. Then again I guess people have to have some place where they can act superior, even if it's just digital items.