Sacred soil don't you think it could be better?

[Lovemonster]

How many fights is it that AoE damage taken so rapidly that the DR from Soil was absolutely needed for everyone to survive? Give Medica 2 and/or Whispering Dawn time to tick and you don't need to bother with Soil.

If we're talking just for single-target mitigation, Soil is almost always worse than Lustrate. If I take 5 Bahamut's Claws and an autoattack for ~1800 apiece, Soil is reducing 180x6=1080 damage. A Lustrate will heal me (~7.6k hp) for 1900.

This person is completely right. If you don't need the soil to survive there is no point using it. It looks cool using it for defensive reaction, tumults, etc; but 10% just makes no difference considering WHM can heal everyone to full regardless of soil use.

That "pro" scholar probably knows what he or she is doing considering sacred soil just makes (almost) no difference whenever it's used.

[Donjo]

i don't wanna be rude but...are you serious?

Yes, I am serious.

first-i never said that my friend think SS is useless,i said that he don't use it and with that i meant that he can manage to heal everyone and keep them alive without using it

You didn't say that SS was useless. You claimed it was a beautiful skill and expressed sentiment that you wish it was more worth using. I'm in the camp that it is worth using as it is and doesn't need a buff.

And, yes, refusal to use something is the same as considering it to be useless.

second-I never said nothing about trying to be a different job so what's with the "trying to be a different one instead" ?

That was not directed at you. It was directed toward the attitude cropping up in the thread that "a 'pro' Scholar just lets the White Mage heal and spends the entire fight DPSing". The retort to this is naturally "If you want to DPS so bad, be an actual DPS."

third- you probably never played as SCH to understand why i'm so mad at this skill setup.

SCH was my third level 50 job and the reason I leveled Arcanist up in the first place. I personally like Sacred Soil and think that it's useful for any situation where forced AOE damage happens. It is a complete waste to just throw it on the tank for no reason, however.

fourth- 20% is not "overmitigation" is just a 10% buff over the actual 10%.Another thing, do you actually think that a 10% dmg reduction in raids is actually THAT usefull? once again if the party gets hit by "4000" it will only reduce 400 hp! Do you actually think that 400 is a great reduction? If you actually wanna know how "BIG" 400 is,try to stay with full hp(assuming you have 5k hp) and receive those 400 as dmg, yeah, no big deal you still have 4,600 hp maybe that will help you to understand a bit more.

I stated no numbers. I merely stated that "all mitigation is useful mitigation". There's never a reason to completely abandon and disregard a skill that you can use to reduce damage. One needs to be very careful with regarding something like 10% reduced damage as useless. For all we know, 20% might become regarded as twice of "useless" and never used too!

As for your numbers, most people seem to be in agreement here that you shouldn't use Sacred Soil to reduce the damage inflicted upon a single person. Apply your 4000 damage attack to an entire 8 man group and you aren't mitigating 400 damage, you're mitigating 3200 damage, which is more than a single Lustrate will heal except on a high iLvl Warrior with Thrill of Battle currently up. This means that your friendly neighborhood White Mage could restore all the damage(or just enough) with a single Medica instead of using Medica II and causing a lot of overhealing in the process, just as an example... and we all know that White Mages are perfectly capable of taking threat with a mistimed Medica II x.x

[Lovemonster]

I don't think people are saying that 10% reduction is useless. It's more to do with the fact that lustrate and energy drain are better uses of aetherflow stacks since sacred soil is usually unnecessary. The only time sacred soil is necessary is if the tank or party members can't survive without it. MP-efficiency wise lustrate is better because, even if we reduce AoE damage, the WHM will overheal in most cases anyway.

The WHM can use medica instead of medica II, but you really have to think in terms of numbers, will a 10% reduction change the WHM's mind about using medica II over medica?

[SeraviEdalborez]

That was not directed at you. It was directed toward the attitude cropping up in the thread that "a 'pro' Scholar just lets the White Mage heal and spends the entire fight DPSing". The retort to this is naturally "If you want to DPS so bad, be an actual DPS."

Hyperbole. A "pro SCH" isn't going to DPS literally all the time. There is just no need to be in full "heal mode" either when you and the WHM together would overheal a lot of damage and, as mentioned earlier, not letting Regen effects tick when you are able to.

Obviously for progression you don't innately know how much is too much. It's something you build up between you and your co-healer and the rest of your group. After a few weeks of Turn 8 (and seeing other Scholars in other forums post up some pretty impressive numbers), we tried one week of letting me go a little more all-out and only healing at the crucial moments. Healing ended up being almost exactly as easy as when I was also healing, except I wasn't wasting MP overhealing or putting up a Succor that didn't absorb anything. I was instead helping end the encounter faster.

DPS is DPS no matter where or who it comes from. Ending an encounter faster is pretty much never a bad thing. Doesn't have to be a full shift from "panic heals" to "ALL THE DOTS". Can be gradual. Was for me.

[Muahbec]

-snip-

Ok you got a point there but...lets just assume we got no WHM in the party just another SCH, succor can't heal fast enough so we gotta physick everyone? D:
About the 4000 damage I just said earlier,
even though we mitigate 3200 (which is basic 400*8) all players will still receive those 3,600 damage ...soooo.........
About my friend....he doesn't use it because he don't need it at all ._. Its not that he refuses to use actually...
You are 100% right at the single target SS...wasting one stack to throw a SS in 1 tank is just ridiculous ...throw E4E instead ..also Adloq can help reducing damage too

Im just saying that a 10% buff would be fine....it would not make the skill OP but increase its utility...its not a HUGE buff its just a plus 10% on its original effect...come on...

Also sorry about getting mad over there u_u

[SeraviEdalborez]

Outside of fights with a huge amount of burst damage on multiple people in rapid succession (Turn 8), double SCH works perfectly fine (and even there it will with coordination and yes, maybe Soil). Double fairies means double "heals I don't have to immediately concern myself with". No need to "spam" Succor.

In some cases (Turn 7, Leviathan EX), I am convinced double SCH is actually better than WHM+SCH or double WHM.

[Muahbec]

Outside of fights with a huge amount of burst damage on multiple people in rapid succession (Turn 8), double SCH works perfectly fine (and even there it will with coordination and yes, maybe Soil). Double fairies means double "heals I don't have to immediately concern myself with". No need to "spam" Succor.

In some cases (Turn 7, Leviathan EX), I am convinced double SCH is actually better than WHM+SCH or double WHM.

Yeah you are right but i still can't see the necessary(use it or get killed/wiped) use of Soil ...

[Nubrication]

Hey Pharazon i'm a big fan of your videos and i learned a lot with them.

But why does it seem that everyone hate the fact that SS needs a buff? you guys fight with everything you can to prevent that buff from happening, why? Most of the fights can be easily finished without it. Sadly SS is not a "really" useful ability since you can basically beat everything in the game without even missing it.
Wasting 1 stack on SS is just useless knowing the fact that you can use a stack on Lustrate.
SS is a "use because is pretty" type of ability. It deserves a buff.

Aetherflow has a 60sec CD. If your friend (who is definitely NOT a PRO if he thinks SS is useless) is playing SCH properly then he shouldn't even be worried about "wasting 1 stack" on SS. If he's saving his aetherflow stacks just for lustrate then he's definitely not maximizing a SCH's potential. Basicially, don't rely on lustrate except for the OHNOES moments.

[Tyurru]

Aetherflow has a 60sec CD. If your friend (who is definitely NOT a PRO if he thinks SS is useless) is playing SCH properly then he shouldn't even be worried about "wasting 1 stack" on SS. If he's saving his aetherflow stacks just for lustrate then he's definitely not maximizing a SCH's potential. Basicially, don't rely on lustrate except for the OHNOES moments.

In doing this you again in term sacrifice Shadow Flare, if it comes around to Aetherflow being recharged and you have stacks left, Energy Drain all dem things!

[Tranquil]

Basicially, don't rely on lustrate except for the OHNOES moments.

Like 95% of the Lustrates I throw out are 'maintenance heals' that I throw out to keep my multitasking going on more efficiently, which in most cases translates to keeping up the DPSing. This ongoing notion about it only being an "oh shit" -heal has always baffled me.