Fundamental problem to party dynamic

[Rogue]

Hey guys,

I thought this was deserving of my first post! and also that i feel strongly enough about this to actually make a post about it lol!

Its gonna look like im bashing the patch but just hear me out!

To cope with the mages not being able to cure bomb the entire party for two reasons

-MP drain
-Emnity gain from curing

People have set up their parties (For HNM, or otherwise "hard" battles) with just one person stood within AOE range (the tank) to stop mages having to cure more than one person.

This seems to be generally the most efficient way to fight HNM atm

You can imagine if a pug, lancer, mrd and glad all get hit with a high damage aoe then the healer is more than likely going to 1, get emnity.. despite how good/bad the tank is and 2, run out of MP... maybe EVEN if there are 2 healers,

So there is really one option which is to set up the party as stated above- which pretty much makes pug, lnc and mrd obsolete (assuming a glad is tanking)

Either im missing something or this is a pretty fundamental problem, tbh its so fundamental im inclined to think i AM missing something.. but i cant figure it out yet lol (and others)

To sum up you can make your life alot easier in HNM or probably even grind parties by taking Archers and mages exclusively.. and a glad to tank

Sorry for the long post

[Warp]

Sounds about right.

[Physic]

nope its basically the regular MMO problem without any semblence of a solution. Some times they increase ranged enimty, or give monsters strong ranged attacks, but its still usually pretty prevalent, the thing is they didnt even try to make this not the case, in fact they promote it even more, By making the main difficulty hp healing management, and making aoe healing costs really high, they basically are telling people that long range is the easiest and most effecient way to play.

And add to that rng is probably the best DD, really gonna need to do some big balancing, only thing im surprised at, is that they didnt see this coming, it was even talked about for pages in the forum.

[Raim]

Too many NMs with massive self casted AoEs. Needs to be more attack/mechanics that keep ranged characters moving instead.

[Neptune]

Great first post. Very well thought through. A pleasure to read.

In many ways the attempt at a tight party dynamic turned out to only work for Darkhold, while unbalancing battle everywhere in the game. The devs need to realize that getting a good dungeon experience is not what this game should be balanced around. They should restore aoe cures, rollback mp costs, and save dungeon balancing for the introduction of the job system. What works in dungeons does not work everywhere in this game. Until then I'm happy to do what they want, which is take mages, gladiator, and archer. Maybe when DD classes are missing out the board will be filled with more support for everyone having a shot at playing the game, as it should be.

[Griss]

Yea the archer onry mentality is starting to show its face very strongly in the darkhold. Quite depressing, And as much as i love my linkshell mates i have been passed over a couple times by ls members in ls runs due to the fact that i swing an axe and don't afraid of anything.

[Verecund]

They really need to strongly differentiate classes and give them specific roles in fights. Or they can go the route of giving every class a certain buff they bring to the party and design encounters/rage timers (if any :P) for that (though this still doesn't fix the problem of classes not having a role outside of those specified by "the trinity").

[kukurumei]

No, I think it's about right, rather it's part of the solution to the armory system, which makes everyone self sufficient.

Instead of making people go into skillsets via restrictions they have made them via battle tactics.

A healer is healing not some super do everything redmage. A blm is retricted to his mp allowance given the job, and tanks and DDs have to consider self preservation rather then trying to out damage another, and expect ample defense.

The MP cost as of now has forced people to actually play their jobs as such the weak definition as it is.

about monster AoEs and ranged..Well since this is new, it's pretty easy to tweak such things. if you want 1 tank and 6 arcs and a conj.....well let's just say WoW has solved that rather easily over time with certain monster AIs.

It's pretty easy to config a monster to make sure your guy in the back is in a world of hurting if he doesn't get flexible.

These days, scenario writers have made sure that the "rear guard" is a sometimes job description

[Rogue]

say your right about DD having to be more self sufficient... it still doesnt nagate the fact that it would be more efficient if they werent there to get hit in the first place.. hence archers and mages... im pretty sure i made this clear

when it come down to it, if SE are going to give mobs AOE attacks and want people to bring mrds and lnc then they have to allow for the party dynamic to work - ONE WAY OR ANOTHER

i think they have gone in the right direction they just seem to have gone from one extreme to another.

[kukurumei]

say your right about DD having to be more self sufficient... it still doesnt nagate the fact that it would be more efficient if they werent there to get hit in the first place.. hence archers and mages... im pretty sure i made this clear

when it come down to it, if SE are going to give mobs AOE attacks and want people to bring mrds and lnc then they have to allow for the party dynamic to work - ONE WAY OR ANOTHER

i think they have gone in the right direction they just seem to have gone from one extreme to another.

No that's an easy problem to fix and has been fixed in other games, even in later FF11.

Whoever said aoe has to be a circle much less around the monster is archaic.

The fact that this change on old scenario monsters is a long time coming to change, just like how every monster has range attacks for some unknown reason.