Gosh darn it

[Ehayte]

Can someone share with me the conventional wisdom behind where each job should rank in DPS in an average fight, and what numbers your standard raider should be hitting in T6-T9?

I ask because my group was falling about 3,000 hit points short of defeating Rafflesia using the burn method about 4 times in a row last night, and I felt like I wasn't pulling my weight as an i98 MNK. The i94 DRG and I were very close in total damage done (I was slightly higher). I am using Wave Patas and he had the Allagan Spear.

I am by no means a perfect or top tier DPS player, but I don't feel like I suck - sometimes I will leave BFB un-activated for a bit too long or forgot to re-apply touch of death for about 10s, but I don't lose GL3 often, if ever.

Since I don't have access to a parser, I'm wondering if anyone has had experience with being an average MNK, then changing to practicing and focusing to an extreme degree on being perfect with rotations and DoT/Buff clipping, and saw a huge DPS improvement? Like a 30-40 dps improvement from that?

Sorry for the rambling and lack of clarity, I just feel disheartened that I wasn't a far-and-away leader in DPS, and I feel like as a MNK I am expected to be.

[Exstal]

From my own experience;

1) Clip demolish if under 6s
2) Clip Touch of Death if under 3s
3) Always use CDs as they come up (except Perfect Balance)
4) You should obtain a parser for personal use (testing rotations and what have you)

[Chokee]

Clip demolish if under 6s

can't i just use snap then refresh demolish next combo? i'd lose 1-2 ticks if i clip it, but i would also lose 1-2 ticks if i don't clip it since there would be like ~3s where demolish isn't applied. i'm not good with theorycrafting so i really can't tell which is better. it might help me finally push 500dps on a dummy hahahaha

[Exstal]

can't i just use snap then refresh demolish next combo? i'd lose 1-2 ticks if i clip it, but i would also lose 1-2 ticks if i don't clip it since there would be like ~3s where demolish isn't applied. i'm not good with theorycrafting so i really can't tell which is better. it might help me finally push 500dps on a dummy hahahaha

I think that question is likely answered by more veteran Monks than myself in The Monk Temple thread. I think you can get away with applying Demolish after it falls (I've heard of some Monks who prefer it that way) but I was told just to keep all DoTs up if possible, so that's what I've always tried to do. I'll do some testing later today!

[Ricdeau]

I've done a lot of testing using the sub 6 second as well as another Snap Punch and let it drop briefly. Either way the difference is very small, and isn't going to be any kind of game changer. I've had parses come out higher/lower consecutively either way. I just recommend that you find a method that you are comfortable with and stick with it. Maintaining your flow mid fight is going to be biggest benefit to stabilizing your DPS. I know a lot of monks that will try to over think a particular situation, and screw something up. Min/maxing is great and strive to eek out all I can, but some of the arguments for some particulars result very tiny gains. So my advice is test it on a dummy, and feel out your comfort level with it. Reliability in my opinion is more important that something might net you 1-2 DPS (sometimes maybe even less) in the end, but risk you screwing up if it's not coming naturally.

Anyway, back on topic. I agree with Scarebears, 280ish for that gear level is good, and as you and your team get more comfortable with the fight it should increase a bit. T6 in itself can just cause some bad luck anyway. It's far from a training dummy fight where you'd attain much higher results with the same gear. From the initial description it sounds like the OPs might just be shy of having what they need to consistently use the burn strat. Too many times I see people get hung up on only trying to do the fight one way regardless of if they can execute it consistently. Sounds like with a touch more gear they will be in the position they want to be now though.

[Ehayte]

I've done a lot of testing using the sub 6 second as well as another Snap Punch and let it drop briefly. Either way the difference is very small, and isn't going to be any kind of game changer. I've had parses come out higher/lower consecutively either way. I just recommend that you find a method that you are comfortable with and stick with it. Maintaining your flow mid fight is going to be biggest benefit to stabilizing your DPS. I know a lot of monks that will try to over think a particular situation, and screw something up. Min/maxing is great and strive to eek out all I can, but some of the arguments for some particulars result very tiny gains. So my advice is test it on a dummy, and feel out your comfort level with it. Reliability in my opinion is more important that something might net you 1-2 DPS (sometimes maybe even less) in the end, but risk you screwing up if it's not coming naturally.

Anyway, back on topic. I agree with Scarebears, 280ish for that gear level is good, and as you and your team get more comfortable with the fight it should increase a bit. T6 in itself can just cause some bad luck anyway. It's far from a training dummy fight where you'd attain much higher results with the same gear. From the initial description it sounds like the OPs might just be shy of having what they need to consistently use the burn strat. Too many times I see people get hung up on only trying to do the fight one way regardless of if they can execute it consistently. Sounds like with a touch more gear they will be in the position they want to be now though.

Your first paragraph was on-topic as well, hehe : D

Yeah, Obviously we we're executing well enough to live to the psuedo-enrage (10 stacks of slimes), so it is either a matter of l2p or get more gear. I will be trying to do a bit of both : D

We're going again Sunday so I am going to do some practicing in T5 or something with my lock-on targeting to see if I can notice a difference in my dps if I am hitting all of my auto-attacks. I really appreciate all the feed-back so far and if anyone else has more to say I'd be eager to hear it.

[duceTRE]

Do you open with Perfect Balance? If tethered, are they quick breaks or do have to travel far to break them. As your going through your rotations I personally don't hold my offensive buffs I just use them as they are up. Now if you open and use a potion of strength, it should more than likely be up in time for the bee or super slug.

[Chokee]

are you strafing to keep yourself facing the target? auto attacks contribute a lot to a monk's dps.

[NintenPyjak64]

At your iLvl a MNK is expected to hit 360+ in certain fights. Sustaining 400+ if you're uninterrupted. This is taking T8 into consideration. From what I've heard, if you have the DPS to beat T6 with the burn strat, you have enough DPS for T8

[Ehayte]

From my own experience;

1) Clip demolish if under 6s
2) Clip Touch of Death if under 3s
3) Always use CDs as they come up (except Perfect Balance)
4) You should obtain a parser for personal use (testing rotations and what have you)

1 - Interesting, I have been trying to let it get down 1s or expiring to get myself another snap punch
2 - Yeah this is my biggest weak point in my rotation, I need to pay more attention to it. I probably need to re-do my UI so that I can see all my buffs and debuffs more clearly
3 - I try to save them (at least BFB) for times when I am not taking dmg or moving too much.
4 - I play on PS4, no can do. This is why I agree with SE on this, I am not able to use it at all so I feel that PC players get an advantage over me, haha.

Do you open with Perfect Balance? If tethered, are they quick breaks or do have to travel far to break them. As your going through your rotations I personally don't hold my offensive buffs I just use them as they are up. Now if you open and use a potion of strength, it should more than likely be up in time for the bee or super slug.

Yes, of course I open with PB, usually Shoulder Tackle>PB>Demo>SP>SP>IR>DK>TW>BS>BFB>TruStr>Demo>ToD.
Usually I just have our melee players eat the vines if it isn't on a spit to build LB, we have a BRD do mana for the WHM so it isn't really an issue. But when we break them its quick, I will either try to stay in melee range of the boss or run out and then should tackle back - FoW>FoF if I think its prudent.
I was using Potion of STR after first blighted to ensure we pushed through with just 1 bee, so it wasn't available in P3 ever.

are you strafing to keep yourself facing the target? auto attacks contribute a lot to a monk's dps.

I could probably re-activate the joy-stick lock-on to do this, I took it off because I would lock on accidentally in stuff like Titan HM or Twinny and get gonked by a landslide or twisters. I suppose I could just be a better player.

At your iLvl a MNK is expected to hit 360+ in certain fights. Sustaining 400+ if you're uninterrupted. This is taking T8 into consideration. From what I've heard, if you have the DPS to beat T6 with the burn strat, you have enough DPS for T8

That's horrible. I think on a mediocre run I did 280. That makes me feel like I suck ass. Is it possible that I am screwing myself really bad by losing auto attacks on movement with PS4 movements?

Also, I wouldn't be too hard on yourself either. Last time I checked t6 thru 9 isn't solo, it's requires a team of 7 other ppl and communication. Just work on the things you think will improve your numbers. You'll get there, just try and keep a cool head about it and you'll get the clear.

I have a clear with the non-burn method. I just feel like as a MNK I should be outDPSing everyone unquestionably, and that since I feel like I'm a good player that should be exacerbated, and its obviously not the case.

Thanks guys - more feedback is appreciated.