Possible Paladin Rework...

[Zenky]

Some thoughts:

Shield Bash and Shield Swipe - Off of GCD. Give both a minor cooldown (8-15 secs?). I would rather they have a cooldown and fights retain a smooth feel than have to choose between cancelling my combo. It forces unnecessary prioritization over our loan combo.

AOE - Not a huge issue, but maybe add an extra skill or give us Overpower. Warrior's get Flash...and we get...Skull Sunder from them?

Invigorate/TP/MP - Why do we, one of the lowest damage classes in the game, have to pace ourselves in DPS? Huh? Warriors have access to Invigorate, but we have no way to replenish our TP? I understand it's the cross-class abilities, but this should be addressed. Food for thought, allow us an ability that lets us USE OUR MP FOR SKILLS. Give an ability that depletes MP and maybe boosts potency of said skills. Kind of like how WHM have Cleric stance. I'm sure everyone's imagination is working out just how well this could sync the class and it's abilities (Riot Blade).

[SwordCoheir]

Some thoughts:

Shield Bash- I prefer they keep Shield Bash as is, it's one of the few party utilities PLD has over other jobs is the ability to stun consecutively if need be.

AoE- Yes an actual GCD AoE to utilize in battle would be a Godsend.

Invigorate- Ummm, WAR doesn't get access to Invigorate, besides TP is a non-issue for PLD in 99% of the scenarios because we don't really have any abilities to burn through TP quickly. So unless you accidentally hit sprint or spam Shield Lob more than a few times I don't even see why you would need Invigorate for anything.

[Zenky]

Shield Bash- I prefer they keep Shield Bash as is...

Invigorate- ...

I'm surprised you would rather have Shield Bash on the GCD...it forces you to choose between starting/restarting our main enmity builder. I get that it has a certain freedom to it (at a cost), but stuns have diminishing effects and I'd rather the ability coincides with such design. If I want to stun/cancel a cast, I want to do it RIGHT NOW, now 2 secs from now. It's clunky and obstructive and needs to change. But to each their own.

I haven't played my WAR in some time, but I thought they really had Invigorate. Anyway, I should be able to Shield Swipe 99% of the time it pops, without penalty of being TP starved, along with Bash and Lob. Why else have an ability PROC or on bar in the first place? This wasn't about giving us Invigorate, but an ability that allows us to use our MP as not only the resource but a modifier of skills (add 20-30 potency per ability while active).

[SwordCoheir]

I'm surprised you would rather have Shield Bash on the GCD

Though not having it interrupt our combo would be a pretty sweet deal, the benefits of Shield Bash being on the GCD are more beneficial end game as we're the only job who has a GCD stun that doesn't require some condition, and it doesn't require people to utilize a stun rotation which can be interrupted for a number of reasons such as someone dies.

[Daniolaut]

Bring war drum back and drop Circle of Scorn or some other similar silly skill (cover is also silly.)

War Drum 1.0:
Delivers a melee attack with your shield to nearby enemies. Generates massive enmity. Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.
TP: 500 / Recast Time: 60sec

War Drum 2.0:
Delivers a melee attack with your shield to nearby enemies with a potency of 100 (or 120 if not massive enmity)
Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.
Addtional Effect: Increased massive enmity.
Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.
TP: 130
Recast (on the global cooldown.)

[Sove92]

Bring war drum back and drop Circle of Scorn or some other similar silly skill (cover is also silly.)

How are they silly? Circle of Scorn is a 250 total potency move over all nearby enemies, off the GCD with a short CD. Cover may be the least used PLD skill, but there are times you can't keep hate on everything, pop Cover on the player being attacked.

War Drum 1.0:
Delivers a melee attack with your shield to nearby enemies. Generates massive enmity. Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.
TP: 500 / Recast Time: 60sec

No one would ever use this skill for such an obscenely high TP cost.

War Drum 2.0:
Delivers a melee attack with your shield to nearby enemies with a potency of 100 (or 120 if not massive enmity)
Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.
Addtional Effect: Increased massive enmity.
Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.
TP: 130
Recast (on the global cooldown.)

You are only gonna use the first version once, the total amount of CoS you'd use on pulls would exceed the hate this skill does. The 120 potency one without hate modifier is even worse, being far weaker than CoS and even dares to cost TP.

[TheodoreMcIntyre]

How are they silly? Circle of Scorn is a 250 total potency move over all nearby enemies, off the GCD with a short CD. Cover may be the least used PLD skill, but there are times you can't keep hate on everything, pop Cover on the player being attacked.

No one would ever use this skill for such an obscenely high TP cost.

You are only gonna use the first version once, the total amount of CoS you'd use on pulls would exceed the hate this skill does. The 120 potency one without hate modifier is even worse, being far weaker than CoS and even dares to cost TP.

War Drum 1.0 was an actual skill from 1.0

[Daniolaut]

How are they silly? Circle of Scorn is a 250 total potency move over all nearby enemies, off the GCD with a short CD. Cover may be the least used PLD skill, but there are times you can't keep hate on everything, pop Cover on the player being attacked.

No one would ever use this skill for such an obscenely high TP cost.

War Drum 1.0 was an actual skill from 1.0

What TheodoreMeIntyre said.

You are only gonna use the first version once, the total amount of CoS you'd use on pulls would exceed the hate this skill does. The 120 potency one without hate modifier is even worse, being far weaker than CoS and even dares to cost TP.

The "2.0 version" i suggested requires the Job PLD to have blocked an attack to be able to use it, which would work in conjunction with flash and bulwark (which flash adds blind, and bulwark increases block rate chance) thus leading to more War Drum procs.

(AKA, making paladin much more fun without being too much like Warrior, and having the skills work more inconjuction. I also would like to keep shield swipe but have it off the global cooldown. If i can have both shield swipe and war drum i'd like to keep CoS, Cover and drop shield swipe for war drum.)

When War Drum is proc'ed youre given the opportunity to generate,

either:

1. Massive threat
or
2. 120 potency of damage+regular enmity gain

(Basically trying to give SE options so they cant simply say "this isnt a skill that would fit in the balance with ARR" when the second option is literally a skill exactly like overpower but needed to proc after blocking an attack. )

Thus making War Drum feel different from Overpower but work exactly like it. So to say Circle of Scorn is better than overpower (since you said CoS>War Drum) is quite very inaccurate.

(I think you might have misunderstood my request. The war drum would either do 100 potency damage but generate more enmity than say flash, or would deal more damage [equal to overpower] with a general enmity gain if the "massive enmity gain" is too "powerful." I personally would like it to deal 100 potency damage with a greater enmity gain so it doesnt feel too much like overpower.)

[Daniolaut]

AoE- Yes an actual GCD AoE to utilize in battle would be a Godsend.

Paladin does have an AoE, (Flash) its just absolutely terrible at generating threat and deals no damage and has an insane MP cost for how much enmity it does generate.

I"m 100% perfectly content not dealing AoE damage as Paladin cause i like playing warrior for that. I dont like the jobs being too much alike.

BUT

Flash does SUCK SO BAD Square-Enix.


If i have to use flash until my MP pool is completely gone and then start using riot blade combo to keep flashing JUST to keep threat on an equal or higher ilvl weapon BLM then the skill is a FREAKING JOKE!
I dont care what any "ePot" "min/max" "i gots all the numbers" person wants to say, if a enmity generation skill cant hold threat on a job that cannot do AoE -damage- enmity generating job like Paladin (so they can focus on what they are good at which is single target debuffing) then its not balanced right.

I personally feel that 2-3 flashes should be able to generate enough threat that a paladin could then go to placing the Rage of Halone debuff on at least 3 mobs before they need to flash again.

That is a much more fun rotation imo.

How PLD AoE should be:

Flash>Flash>Fast blade>Savage Blade>Rage of Halone>Flash>Fast Blade>Savage Blade>Rage of Halone>Flash

(If this is not a combo that PLD can use then i deem Flash useless and not properly balanced)

Because this is how it is, and is BORING AS HELL:

Flash>Flash>Flash>Flash>Fast Blade>Flash>Riot Blade>Flash>Flash>Rast Blade>Riot Blade>Flash

(that is soooooooooooo d@#n boring and clearly shows that Flash is not generating proper threat.)

[Asierid]

Shield Bash and Shield Swipe - Off of GCD. Give both a minor cooldown (8-15 secs?). I would rather they have a cooldown and fights retain a smooth feel than have to choose between cancelling my combo. It forces unnecessary prioritization over our loan combo.

Won't happen with Bash. Only reason WAR has theirs off GCD is due to the cooldown and lack of other interrupts (No. You don't blow holmgang for an interrupt, that's just bad). PLD would have to get a cooldown on theirs in order to make it even remotely balanced (Specially with Spirits have a silence, and swipe having pacify). I believe they actually mentioned this back when WAR was being fixed in 2.1, course I may be wrong on the timing, but I do remember that being brought up somewhere.