More Raid content please!

[Sapphic]

Difficulty is irrelevant. Raids are MULTI-PARTY events. That is the very definition of a raid : more than one party/group.

I would not call Crystal Tower hard. Would you? Its not "tough" at all. Yet it is the raid in FF14.

Binding Coil, whether talking turn 1 or turn 9, is a single-Full Party event. One is not more than one, therefore Binding Coil is NOT a raid.

FF14 needs some more RAIDS, and it needs TOP END raids, not "a step below top end" raids.

Your definition is irrelevant to SEs definition of what consists of a raid in their game They even list in achievements 4 man dungeons as raids.

Successfully complete 20 unique instanced dungeon raids or trials.

Note, dungeon raids, not dungeons, raids. You can complete those achievements without touching a single 8 person or 24 person alliance dungeon.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Your definition is irrelevant to SEs definition of what consists of a raid in their game

They're wrong. What else can I say? They mislabel Coil so they can erroneously claim they have end-game raids, when they do not.

[Sapphic]

They're wrong. What else can I say? They mislabel Coil so they can erroneously claim they have end-game raids, when they do not.

No, this may be hard to swallow, but you are wrong A raid in FFXIV is whatever SE decide to call a raid. Not what anyone or anything else says. They could call them potatoes if they wanted.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Your definition is irrelevant to SEs definition of what consists of a raid in their game They even list in achievements 4 man dungeons as raids.

Successfully complete 20 unique instanced dungeon raids or trials.

Note, dungeon raids, not dungeons, raids. You can complete those achievements without touching a single 8 person or 24 person alliance dungeon.

The lack of commas does not make it "dungeon raids, or trials" .. it makes it "dungeon raids or dungeon trials" - the word "dungeon" applying to both. So, yes, you can complete it without touching a raid. Besides, with all the typos they've had in patch notes, and other areas, do you really expect that they would have caught it if they had unintentionally left out the commas there that would have turned it into "dungeons, raids, or trials"?

[Sapphic]

The lack of commas does not make it "dungeon raids, or trials" .. it makes it "dungeon raids or dungeon trials" - the word "dungeon" applying to both. So, yes, you can complete it without touching a raid. Besides, with all the typos they've had in patch notes, and other areas, do you really expect that they would have caught it if they had unintentionally left out the commas there that would have turned it into "dungeons, raids, or trials"?

Yes, I do think they would have a caught it. Dungeon raids and dungeon, raids are totally different. Nowhere does it mention trials as dungeons either.


Or you are saying they should change trials to dungeons now?

What ever they want to call a raid is a raid in FFXIV ARR. Whatever other games want to call raids is irrelevant. Get over it.

Heres a dictionary definition of Raid, not Wikipedia:

1. A surprise attack by a small armed force.
2. A sudden forcible entry into a place by police: a raid on a gambling den.
3. An entrance into another's territory for the purpose of seizing goods or valuables.

Take special note of the first definition.

[Archulak]

Let me just quote the OP for you.

Difficulty is irrelevant. Raids are MULTI-PARTY events. That is the very definition of a raid : more than one party/group.

I would not call Crystal Tower hard. Would you? Its not "tough" at all. Yet it is the raid in FF14.

Binding Coil, whether talking turn 1 or turn 9, is a single-Full Party event. One is not more than one, therefore Binding Coil is NOT a raid.

FF14 needs some more RAIDS, and it needs TOP END raids, not "a step below top end" raids.

[Tiggy]

So you're telling me that gaming isnt an ever evolving field? Mmo's today are identical to the ones 15 years ago? Games change. The genre changes. Definitions change. It's called innovation and differentiation so that every game isn't the same. If the genre was so stagnant it wound be boring. You need to broaden your personal definition. It's limiting. Coil is a raid, and you need to find a way to live with that fact. What you specifically want us multi party raids. If this thread had been more specific on that point instead of acting like coil doesn't count due to personal definitions then a better discussion may have been had. All this exclusion of coil and outdated definitions are nothing but a distraction from what would have been a more interesting conversation. Lastly, if more group raids is what this is all about then it makes the thread seem simply ill timed since another one come out next week.

[Dhex]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_(gaming)

"A raid is a type of mission in a video game in which a very large number of people (larger than the normal team size set by the game) attempt to defeat a boss monster."

4/8-man is pretty standard and prevalent throughout the game - Story missions, Primals, basic dungeons use 4/8-man parties.

Coil really isn't a raid. If it wasn't for the trash Coil would be exactly the same as Primal fights.

[Tiggy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_(gaming).

Language and definitions are organic things that change. Posting a wiki article isn't a statement of fact. Also, pay attention to the section on how raiding was taking to much time and laws were being passed to limit game time. FFXIV could be seen as the next progression for raids that take this into account and is trying to find a more realistic method. This is especially important done the China release is on the horizon. As I said this rigid definition leaves no room for innovation or positive change.

Fun fact time! That will page was edited "Last edited 8 months ago by an anonymous user." For those of us paying attention that was before FFXIV added CT. So even that page seems to have counted it since it is listed in the games with raids section. Kind pokes holes through wiki as a good source doesn't it?

[Dhex]

For the sake of baseline definition I think the quoted portion is relevant.

Raiding is something large scale.

Coil is not large scale.