More Raid content please!

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Its purely based on number of participants within the framework of the game. This game has two group sizes : the 4 man Light Party, and the 8 man Full Party.

Is it hard to understand that the definition of "raid" is "multiple groups" (or, in FF14 terms, multiple "parties") and has nothing to do with the difficulty of the encounter(s)?

Either all 8 man content is group content. Or all 8 man content is raid content. Castrum, Praetorium, Titan Extreme, Garuda Hard .. if these 8 man pieces of content are group, then other 8 man pieces of content must also be group, which includes Binding Coil. If, however, you want to call an 8 man "full party" a raid, then ALL such instances of 8 man partying are raiding, whether you are raiding level 7 FATEs in some newbie zone, or raiding Castrum, or Ultima Weapon Hard, or Binding Coil.

Since the vast majority of 8 man content is considered group, however, and not raid .. then there is only one raid in FF14 ATM, and that is Crystal Tower, with Binding Coil being group content. Which brings me back to my initial post : we need more raid (multiple Full Party) content!

[Ecks007]

Labrynth of the Ancients was great when you had every team working together to beat the whole instance. Annoying at times when you had a few trolls, but still doable. And last time I checked it was dominated by trolls and practically unplayable because everybody who did it back when it was new and relevant has no use for it anymore.

I actually kinda feel bad for newer players that might want to do it, having to struggle through uncooperative parties and a mass of trolls in the hope of successfully completing it.

But it's still a raid, by definition and by design.

Though, I do agree that the game needs more than 2 raid dungeons. I say 2 because while Coil might have many turns, it's still just one raid encounter. And then there's Crystal Tower which I also count as 1 raid even though it will have multiple separate levels to it.

This is maybe one of the few areas, in my opinion, that FFXIV:ARR falls short. I do love the direction ARR is going for the most part and personally will be playing for a good long while. There should have been three endgame raids, minimum, at launch. Instead, we have Primal Battles which are just boss fights with no exploration or anything. They just feel kind of cheap, even if they are made difficult, it's still just a solo boss fight.. evey, single, one of them. While good to have, it doesn't replace a raid and yet that is what has happened. These Primal battles would be better suited as lass bosses for a raid that leads up to that big fight. Coils and CT are the only instances where boss fights actually take some real effort in order to beat.

In my opinion, there are a few things this game needs: 1) multiple party dungeons (not limited to just Crystal Tower floors), 2) Normal dungeons that are not specifically tied to main scenario content that require a full (8 man) party in order to do, 3) more variety in "Hardest difficulty" dungeons (not limited to just Binding Coil of Bahamut), and 4) some non-instanced multi-leveled "difficult" areas (Where it would be very hard to solo things even as a Summoner) where it would be suggested that 2-4 players at minimum could relatively make progress through in order to explore a new area or (insert another good reason to explore a new area besides "exploration").

[Tashigi]

Raid to me is anything above 20 players. That can be subjective of course. Some people consider coil (8 man) stuff to be a raid.
Anyway...

I'd much rather see a larger variety of 4 man (party) content and open world content (that's locked to 4-8 players upon engaging) than raids.
I don't think raids work for this game as well as they do for other similar MMO.

[Ecks007]

Raid to me is anything above 20 players. That can be subjective of course. Some people consider coil (8 man) stuff to be a raid.
Anyway...

I'd much rather see a larger variety of 4 man (party) content and open world content (that's locked to 4-8 players upon engaging) than raids.
I don't think raids work for this game as well as they do for other similar MMO.

I don't feel that Coil is a raid personally, moreso than that they (all of Coil) are the only hard instances in the game that utilizes an actual full 8-man party. Which is good, we need more 8 man content.. it just doesn't have to quite be at Coil difficulty (accuracy restrictions, etc.) but should be harder than current dungeons are at i100.

To be honest Crystal Tower is the only real raid this game has at the moment. And yes, I too feel actual raids require more than 1 party of players. We also don't even have any raids that raiding FC's can really do because there is no way to form an alliance before going into a raiding instance/dungeon. So that kind of defeats the purpose of big raids, in that, you will never be able to do the whole thing with a group of competent players that you know and that are all in your FC or Server. Which, quite frankly, was a really stupid design move and should be changed.

Having the option to DF it is fine and all, but there should also be the option to have a full pre-made group for raids. (24 players)

[Velox]

God I love threads like these. Always good for a few Sunday laughs ^_^

[Exstal]

Raid, as deemed by SE, is content that requires full party but can not simultaneously be a trial (primals). So deal with it. You can argue semantics all day but that doesn't change what SE has set. Also, more than 8 people content would be a nightmare to set up and content is generally dumbed down to accommodate that many people.

The Japanese basically it, "Bahamut's Dungeon: Encounter 1-5" (for Binding Coil turns 1-5) and "Bahamut's Dungeon: Invasion 1-4" (Second Coil of Bahamut turns 1-4).

[Tiggy]

You don't need massive amounts of people for it to count as a raid. That said you didn't even mention the second coil of bahamut. I can only assume you ignored it because it automatically refutes your post entirely.

[Tiggy]

IF the devs made solo player content and called them raids... would that also be a raid? Would a scientist saying the sky is Brown make it true?

They need to stop calling them raids. They by the definition of the term RAID is not a single party in a mmo.

This has to be the dumbest thing in this thread. A raid is simply a dungeon of heightened difficulty to be tackled by a group of players. Every games defined that size differently. To somehow compare flexible language conditions with the scientific definition of the color blue and the wavelength of the photons that create it is completely ridiculous.

Seriously people. Raids are simply tough dungeons. They are not necessarily multi party at all. This insane definition you have is unrealistic and doesn't for a second take into consideration the differences between games and it doesn't allow for developers to try new things. This isn't the only game to have single party raids either.

[Xatsh]

This has to be the dumbest thing in this thread. A raid is simply a dungeon of heightened difficulty to be tackled by a group of players. Every games defined that size differently. To somehow compare flexible language conditions with the scientific definition of the color blue and the wavelength of the photons that create it is completely ridiculous.

Seriously people. Raids are simply tough dungeons. They are not necessarily multi party at all. This insane definition you have is unrealistic and doesn't for a second take into consideration the differences between games and it doesn't allow for developers to try new things. This isn't the only game to have single party raids either.

Want to tell me where you got that definition? Because I have been playing mmos along time and a not in WoW, EQ, XI, Aion, L1, L2 did anyone ever consider a raid "hard content". That is not what a raid is at all.

Yes some raids are hard and normally are the penticle of endgame. But in all game mentioned low man endgame content that was difficult in all other mmos I mentioned never called them raids.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Seriously people. Raids are simply tough dungeons. They are not necessarily multi party at all. This insane definition you have is unrealistic and doesn't for a second take into consideration the differences between games and it doesn't allow for developers to try new things. This isn't the only game to have single party raids either.

Difficulty is irrelevant. Raids are MULTI-PARTY events. That is the very definition of a raid : more than one party/group.

I would not call Crystal Tower hard. Would you? Its not "tough" at all. Yet it is the raid in FF14.

Binding Coil, whether talking turn 1 or turn 9, is a single-Full Party event. One is not more than one, therefore Binding Coil is NOT a raid.

FF14 needs some more RAIDS, and it needs TOP END raids, not "a step below top end" raids.