This game needs depth, Please implement a second weapon (playstyle) for each job

[Jubez187]

Problem is, is that eventually every "choice" you get will be Min/Maxed and only 1 build will be viable. And then you'll get kicked if you don't conform to the build. SE devs will see which builds are currently META and they will use those builds and party make-ups to test out new raids and content. If the content is being balanced around a certain META, then you can bet your bottom dollar that that META is going to stay META. Then, in the next patch, SE will say "Okay we're redoing the skill trees!" and the same thing will repeat.

see: League of Legends, World of Warcraft.

You can say "well SE can balance around a bunch of different builds and party make-ups" well, that just leads to sub-par content overall and trying to spread yourself too thin. The content would also probably be ridiculously easy once figured out and the builds and party make-ups were min/maxed.

[Sylve]

Either you lie.Or you never took the 40 gold to pay the second skill set. which was COMPLETELY different to the other if you wanted it to be, even its very separate rune book (was that the term?). I had my Warrior full tank on one, and full dps on the other, You only had pointless abilities if you decided to invest points in them.
And yes this was implemented too in WotLK

Lmao, You got a few things wrong. Well, all of it wrong. 99% of your "rotation" came from Base Class Skills. The ones you learned from a Trainer. The old Talent Tree were 1-5 talent Point dumps for percentile damage boosts on specific skills, or types of skills. At certain points in the old Tree, there was a Skill to get, costing yet another Talent Point, this was the "Key" skill for that Spec, Arms had Mortal Strike, Protection had Devastate, Fury had Bloodthirst. Sometimes, the Tree cap was also a Skill, but most of the time it was a powerful passive.

So in short, Yes, my Protection Warrior had all of 4 Rotational skills (Heroic 'Carpal Tunnel' Strike, Spam Flavor Devastate, sometimes a Shield Slam proc and why did the adds spawn AFTER Thunderclap) to use mostly, while the skills the other specs used were pointless, like (why is it on my bars Rend).
For a Paladin, It got even worse. As a Ret or Prot Paladin, you could use NONE of your Healing abilities, and the only one you got via Talents was (Delicious Bacon of Light). Other than that, it was Flash of Light or the longer cast time one that i cant remember the name of.
Druids were the worst for it though. Feral (Cat) skills were only usable in Cat Form, same for Bear Skills and Bear Form. Moonkin was blocked from casting anything that wasn't in the Balance tree, and a Restoration Druid had all the same healing spells as every other spec, until they got Wild Growth.
The game was full of that. Earlier versions of WoW had more Skills than your keyboard has keybinds.

What you are referring to is VERY new. The new version of the Talents has not been around for all that long. Back in my day, we had to visit a Trainer and fork out a progressively more expensive Respec Fee to change specs. Dual Specs have not been around since day one.

And when i said "new and interesting the first time", i was referring to the ability to switch between them. My Prot Paladin (leveled entirely Prot back in the days of Consecrate ->JudgeSealJudgeSealJudgeSeal+Auto Attack was all your could do until you finally got the Shield skill) early in WOTLK went Holy for a change of pace. Which was VERY new, very interesting the first time i ran with it. Then when i realized i could do exactly the same thing in my Prot spec with Holy gear on ...

Oh, and if you think XIV gear sharing with healers and Mages is bad, you obviously never did play WoW, where 3 or more classes would roll off on the same piece of loot, and it was(LOL, still is) just as bad for Tier Tokens. Losing the Best in Slot Agility Main Hand Dagger for my Subtelty Rogue to a Hunter who wanted a statstick to go with his statstick Agility Sword was rather painful, to say the least. Losing the best Tanking trinket that drops out of Black Temple to the DPS Druid just because he could need on it also by virtue of being a Druid also sucked.

Clearly, YOU never played WoW in its past and beleived its current iteration and systems is the one it launched with. Vanilla was an absolute mess. BC was amazing, WOTLK started OK, died in the end and its been on a downward spiral ever since. I don't ever want to see XIV Devs making the same stupid mistakes the WoW team made.

[Sylve]

-snip-Monks having to choose either gauntlets or greaves where wearing greaves would greatly enhance and modify attacks with kick animations (only 2?) while weakening punch attacks (inb4 why not both).

I often wonder why we DON'T have both for Monks. The game lore for Monks specifically states they use the Hora's to increase their destructive power, which is why i really liked the Monk Darklight legs. The foot spikes were a nice thematic touch when Dragon Kicking, lol.

[Gardes]

I often wonder why we DON'T have both for Monks. The game lore for Monks specifically states they use the Hora's to increase their destructive power, which is why i really liked the Monk Darklight legs. The foot spikes were a nice thematic touch when Dragon Kicking, lol.

Personally I have never liked the grip weapons since the FFXI days. I would have really liked it a gauntlet line is available as an option, covering the entire of a monk's gloves when equipped.

Easiest one I can remember is DMC3 Dante's beowulf. Or onimusha's soul absorbing gauntlets (though they just use it to absorb souls and use swords to attack).

[Sylve]

Personally I have never liked the grip weapons since the FFXI days. I would have really liked it a gauntlet line is available as an option, covering the entire of a monk's gloves when equipped.

Easiest one I can remember is DMC3 Dante's beowulf. Or onimusha's soul absorbing gauntlets (though they just use it to absorb souls and use swords to attack).

Yeah, Part of the reason i love Garudas Talons so much is that they appear much more like a gauntlet than usual since it has that feather covering the grip area. I would love to see them, even if they were added as a 'style' thing made by a crafter, similar to the dresses and whatnot.
That should be a thing , "Decorative" or "Ceremonial" weapons made by crafters with crazy weird looks, for Glamor only lol.

[Valthein]

Problem is, is that eventually every "choice" you get will be Min/Maxed and only 1 build will be viable. And then you'll get kicked if you don't conform to the build. SE devs will see which builds are currently META and they will use those builds and party make-ups to test out new raids and content. If the content is being balanced around a certain META, then you can bet your bottom dollar that that META is going to stay META. Then, in the next patch, SE will say "Okay we're redoing the skill trees!" and the same thing will repeat.

see: League of Legends, World of Warcraft.

You can say "well SE can balance around a bunch of different builds and party make-ups" well, that just leads to sub-par content overall and trying to spread yourself too thin. The content would also probably be ridiculously easy once figured out and the builds and party make-ups were min/maxed.

Prolly why I usually get booted or harassed in say wow, I never conform. I'v ran dungeons with a hunter no pet out just pure Marksman ship dmg. Iv done dungeons with a pet but back in the day duel wield only using swords never touching a range weapon. lol all the times people would freak out like it was the end of the world, funny stuff. Im sorry but if I like to play with one skill over another for w/e reason even if that other skill is more "viable" Im going the way I fancy. As long as your not hindering the progression of the group, and I mean 5 wipes on boss #1 then there is no reason to have cookie cutter classes. People need to just think for themselves and play whats fun not what they're told to play b/c its the "better way". this isn't real life, no ones life is on the line your not going to get your whole platoon killed in the middle of the enemies camp. I'd like to walk in to a group drop a fireball as a tank on a mob just to agro everything then pick up a hate build rotation, or a healer who can use blizzard with a bonus effect of insta freezing EVERYTHING even bosses for 4 secs to save the group from a huge insta wipe if its timed just right.

[Hiruke]

Other games have "specs" precisely because you only have one class per character, as opposed to this game where you have all classes per character. It doesn't make any sense to respec a job. Just switch to a different job.

Lots of people think being able to "choose" from a lot of different options is "good", but the reality is that there will often/always be an "optimal" setup, and others will mostly be ignored. Yes, some people will do weird stuff for no reason, but you have that now: Some people use a good, proper rotation and do good dps. Other people do NOT use a good, proper rotation, and they are a wasted slot in your party, sometimes doing less damage than even the tanks.

The game lacks depth because of 1) a lack of content (viable content is like... Second Coil) 2) a lack of interesting content (FATEs, Levequests, guildhests, almost all dungeons, etc. are trivial to complete and offer next to zero interest - only truly fun content is primal fights, and most people can't even do them properly) and 3) trash mobs are... trash (fighting Mob X is almost identical to fighting Mob Y - they are not dangerous or mechanically interesting, mostly because they are too low level and don't use skills that really threaten the party).

This could easily be solved by making more content, introducing content that's actually fun, and cranking up the level of trash mobs. I wish FFXIV team would confer with FFXI and talk over things that actually work/are enjoyed by players in an MMO, as there are many good systems in FFXI, and yet FFXIV seems determined to put in only the most generic/boring types of systems possible, presumably with the intention of making it "easy" for people to get into... but this creates a distinct lack of lasting value to most content.

[Gormogon]

I would like some actual form of customization and I would personally love that customization come from a variety of areas.

1.) Sub jobs: Increases stats based off your secondary job and from the secondary job abilities, currently since there's 5, you can choose 1 out of the 5 job abilities as your cross job skill that will become a dedicated primary job ability for you to use. Either you get an ability to use for your rotation or one of your primary job abilities gets augmented.

Examples.
Dragoon/War. Vit+20/Str+10.
Defiance: Increases your crit rate (when you complete your combos stacks up to 5x)
Inner Beast: 300 potency ability that ignores 25% of the enemies armor
Unchained: You can reposition yourself as you jump into the place where you'll land. (Everyone see's you jump and so do you but you don't actually jump and instead turn into a shadowy figure and move to where you want to land.)
Steel Cyclone: Delivers an attack with a potency of 200 to all nearby enemies.
Infuriate: Increase determination by 15%

Dragoon/BLM. +20int/10pie
Convert: Turns 20% of MP into HP
Freeze or Spineshatter Jump augment (Ring of Frost): Additional: Covers a designated area in ice binding the enemies inside.
Apocatastasis: Increases your resistances to all elements by 20%
Manawall: Manawall animation + stonekins effect
Flare or Dragonfire Dive augment (Ring of Flame): Additional: Leave the ground ablaze, delivering damage with a potency of 30 to enemies that enter the flames.

2.) Ability enhancing materia: Giving materia usefulness. Each type of armor can contribute to a specific type or role of spell/ability (works with cross class and cross job abilities).

3.) Merit System x Talent Tree x New Age 2hr. Instead of making your job branch into different roles, which that wont be the purpose of this talent tree. Instead it will only customize your way of play. Yet to activate these abilities you build a gauge like previous Final Fantasy games. Your progress resets when you change zones.

You're not restricted to customizing 1 ability. You can customize a certain amount of abilities and give them effects. Yet when you active the one that suits your style of play your are restricted to the choices you make within that time period.

Trance: Empowers the next 3 set of class abilities slightly.
Overdrive: Empowers 1 of your primary job abilities drastically.
Quickening: Create your own combo and effect. Class to Job skill finisher.

[Exstal]

If you want more specialization you'll have to wait for the expansion when they are supposed to add second jobs to each class.

Do you have proof of this speculation?

[Valthein]

Do you have proof of this speculation?

ya, it was announced in the live letter on youtube live if you watched it for e3. maybe not in this coming xpac but Yoshi does state they are looking in to making multiple roles to each class. although I will say im not sure if by second jobs he means roles ie tank healer dd but this was discussed and they want to add additional roles to each job.