Yoshi-P got it wrong. The mind of a win trader and a solution to win trading

[VinhSama]

1) Why would I que all 3 categories...

2) whatever magical world you are living that only 5 min is a que you need to realize this is a bold face lie.

3) I can play 5million times better then them and we will still loose.

1) Queueing all categories decreases queue time.

2) 5 minute queue times is peak hours in the Primal servers. At least it has been for the past month or so that I've been pvping non-stop.

3) 1 player can make a huge difference. An amazing healer can turn a game around with proper kiting and swift raising, a CCing BLM will absolutely cripple the enemy team as well (that's why they're usually prime target). I've seen a dragoon solo a WHM, MRD and MNK after my team fell, and the MRD and MNK were full hp (though they did burn CDs).

I wasn't implying it was possible to win 100%, but rather I was making the point that being significantly good will increase your win rate, lowering your grind time. The 100% figure was meant dubiously; like "in a perfect world, this would happen".

[VinhSama]

Make a specal lvl 50 pvp queue when gear/morale does not matter at all. Problem solved. Pvp should be about equal competition for ranking where only SKILL matters, not time/money invested to get raw power.

Frontlines is a great step forward in this matter.

In that case, end game gear trumps all. The difference between i9X and i110 is astounding. Even if we're talking about Weathered Soldiery gear, i110 high allagan+non-weathered soldiery gear and i115 weapon will dominate. Assuming all other factors are equal, i100 morale is the only thing that can beat an i110 player with t9 on farm and nothing better to do. How is that any different? In the end, gear matters whether you remove morale or not, the only difference is morale takes an investment in time toward pvp, whereas SCoB gear takes an investment in time toward end-game raids.

[Murakamo]

Reality of queue times during peak hour. Longest 5 minutes of my life.

I'll admit though, it's usually not this bad. Maybe 20 minutes.

Other roles are no different (except healer, seems being the priority target is enough to deter people from playing that role).

[blowfin]

Sadly the structure of Wolves Den is conducive to win trading, and win trading only serves to exacerbate the problems.

- Gear is attractive so people want it (base PvP player pool)
- PvP is fun so people want to try it
- The grind and wait times are so long long that most people stop doing PvP
- Players who want to continue can't make meaningful progress
- Players start win trading, leaving even less players in the normal PvP pool
- The cycle repeats ad nauseum


Although, I do have a feeling that Frontlines is going to make Wolves Den just about totally obsolete.

[A_Magical_Unicorn_Rider]

Sadly the structure of Wolves Den is conducive to win trading, and win trading only serves to exacerbate the problems.

- Gear is attractive so people want it (base PvP player pool)
- PvP is fun so people want to try it
- The grind and wait times are so long long that most people stop doing PvP
- Players who want to continue can't make meaningful progress
- Players start win trading, leaving even less players in the normal PvP pool
- The cycle repeats ad nauseum


Although, I do have a feeling that Frontlines is going to make Wolves Den just about totally obsolete.

What's to stop people from wintrading there? Or anywhere, for that matter?

[Orophin]

I always figured it was the queue times that drove people to do this. When it comes down to it, PvP is really one of the last things that come to mind when people think Final Fantasy, so the amount of people actually interested in it and will do it for an extended period of time is very small.

[saber_alter]

What's to stop people from wintrading there? Or anywhere, for that matter?

it wouldn't be practical. the battles are 30 minute long bouts and consist of three full alliances.

[Tiggy]

What's to stop people from wintrading there? Or anywhere, for that matter?

Good luck convincing thre teams of 24 to pull that off. The size of the event is the biggest thing that will prevent it.