I just wanted to point out a double standard...

[Nicobo]

No, it removes the double standard by putting a DPS' performance out in the open. Because Tanks and Healers already have their performance out in the open.

Um.. ok I can agree above statement. Again, I welcome dps meter.
But what my concern is then some people may say why no meter to show damage migrated and hp healed.
In this case how to explain to them there is not a double standard?

[Madruck]

OP, you have got to remember that most players who play on MOBA's or MMO's play for the sake of elitism. These players would rather show a real lack of understanding and not help their fellow players learn the game because they want to only play with fellow elitist like themselves. I hear all the time people stating that they do not want to wait for people to watch CS or help explain fights because of their own time....whats the point of playing a MMO if its not to play with other people and help them enjoy the game as well. To all the players who state that they do not want to repeat something they have done 100 times....welcome to the world of gaming in where developers have being using the same model since 1985. If you can't hack people playing the game the first time and learning or wait for people to watch the CS, go party up with other elitist like yourself and never que for solo content again so we don't have to deal with players like you.....

[Odett]

snip

Nice going with that generalization.

New players should definitely watch cutscenes, but the video argument is a different story. If you're doing EX Primals or anything above BCT3, watching a video beforehand just shows respect for the time of other players. I never expect other players to watch or read a guide, but you have to understand that when you don't, you're expecting another player to tell you about a fight with multiple phases and mechanics (something you could have done while waiting for the group to form) and you will wipe multiple times because you're going in blind, and the wiping process could have been much shorter if you had watched a video. It's good for experienced players to help people that are new to something, but after some time, always being relegated to explain things to people going in blind and wiping from the same mechanics over and over again is just extremely tiring.

That's not elitism, it's hoping everyone pulls their weight because it's a team effort. Parsers can help achieve that. In a 4 person dungeon, it's usually very easy to tell when a DPS is performing poorly (especially when you're the other DPS), but it's harder to do so in an 8 person fight. Always taking gear into account, if your DPS is noticeably lagging behind others, then you should be held accountable for it, and that is the double standard that the OP is addressing.

Another great use of parsers is to measure your own DPS. Maybe you want to try an experimental rotation, or tweak with your personal nuances of it, or do a fight that you're not acc-capped for in your current gear, and see how many pieces you can downgrade to in order to meet the accuracy cap before it makes your DPS worse.

[Massterchef]

Still have no clue how a parser can make a player toxic

[LunarEmerald]

Still have no clue how a parser can make a player toxic

"Turn 6. Runthrough and super slug. Must have 300 dps or kick"

[Massterchef]

"Turn 6. Runthrough and super slug. Must have 300 dps or kick"

The initiator of the PF would still kick people who he felt under-performed regardless if he had a parser or not and the standard would still be "Must have high dps or kick". This is one of many bad examples of a player you perceive to be toxic, having and expressing his high standards, not a parser turning someone into a toxic player.

I still have yet to see a compelling argument.

[TheMax1087]

Still have no clue how a parser can make a player toxic

A parser won't make a good person toxic, but it can tip a borderline person towards being toxic, and will definitely make an already toxic person more toxic. It's really about the difference between 1. "Your dps is low, here's some ways to boost it" 2. "Your dps is low, play better or gtfo" and 3." Your dps is crap and you are garbage, you should log off and go kill yourself(I actually saw a tank say this to a blm in t4 once). Things would probably be ok if everyone fell between 1 and 2, but as anyone who's actually played this game for a while can see, there are far too many players, mostly younger ones who haven't mastered common decency, that fall between 2 and 3 to add an ingame parser, as not everyone is thick skinned enough to ignore it.

[SarcasmMisser]

What is your actual mana and skill usage difference between a monk popping fists of earth during raid wide damage and not.

[Raikki]

You can parse the message log files the game outputs in your user directory to calculate DPS, too, though. Since doing that doesn't interact with the game itself in any way, how does that qualify as a TOS violation? I'm not saying that's what people are doing when they announce DPS, but if the same information can be obtained in a way that doesn't violate the TOS, then someone can't be known for sure to be breaking the TOS simply for being able to come up with those numbers.

[ruskie]

I was subject to parsers myself. But so far it wasn't a bad experience. Most of the time it's mostly in joke runs/fun runs(or doing treasure maps as DoL/DoH mixed with others) and someone just goes this person did the most etc... Only had it used in a PF group once... was announced and my reaction was... if this leads to harrasement report. Turns out I was underperforming even with my best rotation by 15%(compared to others) - not sure if the parser was taking DoTs into account or not though at that time. But I wasn't being harrased about it. We tried a few times to see if it can be improved - I probably was the weakest geared at the time and I was saving my TP and CDs for the real burn phases and not just blowing all CDs on opening(which might account for a lower DPS).

Actually had a nice chat with that person after the failed tries with no hard feelings on either end - and they were trying to understand it.


There is a time and place for parsers. But in runs where people are already on edge for trying to do their best a parser can cause a split if people don't know each other well.

I believe a usable in game parser could be done by having it a vote option when entering a duty. Each person get's a popup for - do you wish to allow designated person to parse or not(with a pre-default set in settings). This way parties can allow this and also designate it to someone that actually has a clue about what they are doing with a parser.