Lower the TP cost on Piercing Talon

[Altena]

As for the issues with such skills like Feint and One Ilm Punch, the main reason they are useless is either:
a) The debuff doesn't stick
b) There is no reason to debuff (or dispel) anything worth while.

If the devs wanted to adjust these skills to make them useful, then the easiest way would be to allow them to stick to a boss - or introducing a mechanic that requires it (such as an attack buff on a certain boss that can be dispelled with One Ilm Punch), or taking these skills off GCD with 0 TP cost, and perhaps lowering the potency.

However that is a topic for another day. The only point of this thread is to allow Talon to be used at end game without it being taxing enough to the point of it actually being a set back.

[Spartan117]

Snip

Sorry to say, but you are not part of the dev team, and the engagements (aside from a few specific fights) require melee to detach from the mob from time to time - even Turn 6 is a great example, with the vines/tethers. If you are under the impression that all melee just stand next to the mob and bash it *all the time* then you are gravely mistaken I am afraid.

I'll address your impression that melee is forced to no being able to stand next to the mob and bash it all the time. The definition between a good melee player and an average melee player is his ability to stick on to the boss as much as possible, minimizing down-time.

No offence both of u, Altena and Altaeciana have valid points but im not too sure whether you understand what makes a good melee dps and what makes a efficient raid.

Let's just use your example of Turn 6. Common mistake of average melee dpsers, not hitting the boss when you don't get vined or floral trapped and tunneling in on getting into the "right position". That's down-time no matter what and does reducing TP of PT help here for inactivity? Answer is no.

Yes getting vines attached to u is annoying. Do you and your raid break the vines fast enough so that you can get back on the boss and minimize downtime and most importantly take minimal damage such that your healer doesn't need to top you up? Does reducing TP of PT here help? Answer still no cause of the instability of firing PT while on the move, making you move back towards the boss and possibly making you walk back into the danger zone while lengthening the time period to break the chains thus taking more damage.

Yes getting floral trapped is annoying, it purposefully makes you stay away from rafflesia. Throwing PTs while waiting for it to go off is cool, you get say 3 to 4 PTs off waiting for the sign to be off you. Here the difference between an average melee and a good melee is that an average melee tries to slowly walk back to rafflesia after the trap sign goes off and a good melee jumps back (shoulder charge low cd, drg 3 jumps to bring u to the boss) after rafflesia does devour. Is the TP cost of 3 to 4 PTs punishing? No because of the other boss mechanic called Blighted Bouquet. It's essentially a 120-180 TP top up thanks to making your character inactive for 2 to 3 ticks. So does reducing TP cost of PT here help? Negligible impact, i rather you increase the damage of PT. DRG's fall off DPS is already disgusting enough compared to any class in the game.

Any good DRG definitely will not run out of TP in any of the fights, with the SOLE exception of Turn 8. You will run out of TP if you are missing your initiation skills (Impulse Drive, Heavy Thrust) because of bad positioning. They made it exceptionally punishing to miss such skills by having these skills cost 10 more TP than ur battle time TP regen. Using Phble, Disembowel and the above 2 skills at the wrong rotations also have the same impact.

Rather than crying foul at the TP cost of PT, which im totally dumbfounded for why people even bothered to argue this, why don't spend more time propositioning higher potency for three-Thrust combo because our DPS drop off after the first 30 seconds of the fight till the 3rd minute of the fight is so bad that we will never ever catch up with monk's DPS in long fights ever, given the same gear set and player proficiency.

Peace.

[Phyllo]

Snip

Seriously??! I thought for sure that I once received an item that give some tp like the potions do (tho I never used it since invigorate, praise the eggnook, is more than enough to me)

But I admit PT is kinda poorly made, but still usable, all I did was saying that you can use it without running out of tp and situation in which it can be useful, but yeah unless you're in that precise kind of situation you have absolutely no reason to use it and even in those situation you can easily keep going without using it *cough* titan ex with his lame ass range for aoe *cough* x3

Altena.... I once saw a 50 pugilist going for a primal once xD so there are people who just don't give a crap about jobs (well in his case he didn't even knew that the job system exist >_>)

[Velox]

Remember that SE designed these skills with a 2 year road map already planned out. It may be that, while PT is not THAT useful for a DRG, it could very well be incredibly useful for Lancer's 2nd job (most likely some sort of light tank with utility), thus why they felt the large TP cost was needed.

Not saying this is a definite, but just as a reminder that SE has this game planned out a LOT farther than most people realize.

[Phyllo]

You must also remember that this skill existed way before yoshida and the gang took the game, so the purpose it had back then is no longer the same.

Also, if they wanted to make this a tank skill, it would have a effect on enmity, the problem is that it doesn't and that you have to throw it quite a lot of time to actually get the mob if his enmity on your pal is high (I know because I once had to tank due to some "not the dungeon I want, seeya" guy)
So unless they bring some change to the skill, it won't be usable for tanks since the tp cost is way to high to rely on this to get mobs on you.
Personally I think they just kept it because it already existed but didn't knew what to do with it, I may be wrong but at least that way I don't wonder too much about it and do go wild with crazy theories u_u

[NintenPyjak64]

Seriously??! I thought for sure that I once received an item that give some tp like the potions do (tho I never used it since invigorate, praise the eggnook, is more than enough to me)

There is, but it's PvP only:
Regain Feather
Icarus Wing

[Phyllo]

There is, but it's PvP only:
Regain Feather
Icarus Wing

Oh.... Pvp only huh.... Oh well then tank or not, dont use it too much or you're screwed, simply xD

[Alistaire]

DRG does well enough with the tools it has as they are. Just because you'd like them to be better in a different way doesn't mean the job itself would still be balanced if you got that buff.

You can't just ask for a skill to be buffed without considering that larger question: "Is the job balanced? Would it be balanced with this buff?"

As far as Feint goes, it was mentioned as another bad skill. It's obviously more of a support skill, actually makes quite a difference if you're soloing tough caster mobs LoS'ing their spells, and isn't quite as bad on a job that has lower potency per hit like BRD, not as a regular thing of course, but there's fights where the slight dps loss is worth the utility. I've soloed caster mobs in leves 5 levels above me that would've wrecked me if they could get their spells off.

[Phyllo]

The problem alistaire, is that feint becomes truly useless in end game since most mobs are immune to slow, which means that what looked at first like a nice support skill becomes an useless benchwarmer

[Alistaire]

Last place I remember using it was on BRD @ CT on iron giants. 1 person sac'ing only 20? potency for an attack in a situation with 12 dps to support the healers' need to cure that tank is hardly a useless benchwarmer, nor does it have to become a star of the show to be worthwhile.

It goes back to the bigger picture, are the jobs that can access it balanced? Yes. One could even say BRD is a bit stronger than balanced so they'd want to be careful about buffing skills they put to better use than the main job that gets them.