This game is far to difficult.

[Eshthar]

I hear more whining bout casuals then i ever thought in this game.
So time to get Serious guys:
Casual by itself is everybody who dont have the time / exp or skill to clear teh Content within an short Time.
I am still an Casual but allthrough i got T5 - T7 down with my FC it took many Time but we got it.
The Problem is not that were Casuals the Problaem, in fact is that casuals are known to get loot and Stuff for free from other games. ( yeah thats right im looking at WoW, SW:TOR and all these others)
Most of em refer to WoW but in fact how many of You guys Played WoW before WOTLK?
Blizz made the mistake to soften up everything for those "casuals" thats what broke em.

just try to get an there on an Vanilla or BC P - Server and see what happens.

These ecounters we have may seem hard but if u use your mind and your job right it is still possible to get them down.

[LadyVaJedi]

When I played Dungeon and Dragons Online there were instances like these here and when you were in a party the group could pick from easy to hard and that would be a great option for players. If it could be done.

[Jubez187]

Game isn't difficult, but just oddly designed. Low pressure on class mechanics, high pressure on boss mechanics. Many situations in bosses where there are points of no return (insta wipes, people falling off map and can't be raised, etc etc). I wish the bosses were more simple, but depended more on class mechanics and individual skills, but that would take redesigning of the classes to make the rotations much harder.

[Azell]

them angry birds generation...

[Xairos]

This is what I don't get, if you made the one-shot mechanics not one-shot anymore (or in an easy version of the raid), then you could possibly run into the issue of players forgetting that the difficulty is ramped up on the normal version.

ex: "Oh im not used to having to move for that part" If, for example if Twintania's conflags didn't kill you but did like 1/3rd damage.

I had a person completely ignore garuda (hard) cone aoe and dps her through the animation and we just burned her down. Anytime we get mechanics that dont outright kill us we wind up just blatantly ignoring. Ultimately I say keep the mechanics as they are so players can cut their teeth on em to try to get better.

[kazin]

+1 for content tiers. Currently SE is making two sets of content; CT for casuals and BCoB for the raiders. This means that each group gets new content every TWO patches when they really could be getting content every patch.

Imagine the progression was like this:

Game launch, patch 2.0...
BCoB1 => Normal => Exactly like it was in 2.0.

A few weeks later, patch 2.0.5...
BCoB1 => Easy => Mechanically easier, bosses with lower health and damage. Rewards: tomes *only*!

Patch 2.1 rolls around...
CT => Normal => More difficult than it was in 2.1. Rewards: i100 gear!

A few weeks later, patch 2.1.5...
CT => Easy => Exactly like it was in 2.1.

Patch 2.2 rolls around...
SCoB => Normal => Exactly like it was in 2.2.
Levi HM => "Easy" => Exactly like it was in 2.2 (story progression), except he now drops i90 weapons with some rarity.
Levi EX => "Normal" => Exactly like it was in 2.2, except he now drops i100 weapons (no mirrors anymore.)

A few weeks later, patch 2.2.5...
SCoB => Easy => Mechanically easier, bosses with lower health and damage. Rewards: tomes *only*!

Patch 2.3 rolls around...
CT2 => Normal => High tiered gear (i120?), challenging mechanics.
Ramuh HM => "Easy" => Story progression, lower tiered drops.
Ramuh EX => "Normal" => Higher tiered drops, more challenging mechanics.

You get the idea.

Casuals get basically the same progression that exists now except they can actually experience the coil storylines! Raiders get exclusive access to challenging content every patch instead of every other patch. Reserve titles, achievements, and the great loot for the normal mode rewards. It's not about the reward. There are *so many* players who just want to play the available content and experience the story in a *relaxed*, casual, "i am spending my limited entertainment time trying to relax after/before work" manner. These people just want to play a game to unwind and have fun; socialize with their FC, whatever.

Eventually (3-4 patches past initial release) the normal versions would be so outgeared that carries or casual completion is possible, even commonplace, so casual "collectors" looking to get the gear *can* do it, they just have to wait.

[Zarzak]

I have been stuck trying to clear Coil Turn 5 for months. I know how to do the fight perfectly but it doesn't matter if the others can't do it. I have joined countless "farm" parties that can't survive twisters. Finding a full party of decent players is like winning the lottery, clearly raids on this game are just to much for the majority of players.

Why can we not have two tiers of raids like WoW? Instead of making an even harder mode of Coil that nobody will be able to do, when its already extremely challenging,

Well A. The Raid finder has generally been considered the worst thing to ever happen. Ever. And is largely credited as the reason subs took a huge hit. But more importantly...

Bolded.


If you know the fight perfectly and are only failing because your groups with pugs and bad players. The content is not challenging and in fact it is not. Any RAIDER (not someone who says "I want to raid so I will!!" but someone who puts in the time, energy, and effort to know their class and the fight. Can and has (ask any guild working through 6-9) learned every fight in under 15 hours each. Which is less than a dozen instance timers.

Just because the raid content isn't being pugged (its RAID content it shouldn't be) does not make it hard. Raids are content designed for high end organized teams. CT is what your looking for if your not interested in joining one.

I refuse to believe that either of these fights are easy.

How long have you all spent as a group engaged on these fights? Because if it's less than 10 hours... It is easy you need to put more time in. If it's more than 20 hours your group has someone in it who is very very slow and/or not a raider.

No fights in this game are hard. Hell get a cheerleader squad. They learn cheers in less time than this I'm sure and if anyone believes FFXIV raids are not as choreographed as that they are not paying attention. You could LITERALLY write down a step by step guide to any class for any fight in the game right now. If a dog can learn how to open a door and play fetch someone with half a brain who cares enough to pay enough attention can do any of these fights.

Hell for arguments sake lets go through T5 as a melee dps in clip notes form.

Step 1: Tanks engage pick one of the adds and do your rotation until it dies.
Step 2: move to another add and repeat.
Step 3: move to the last add and repeat.
Step 4: move to Twintania and do your rotation
Step 5: Collar piece falls off. Hold until someone gets a red triangle over their head. If you go to step 6a. If not go to step 6b.
Step 6a: Move to designated fireball drop point (likely a pile of pets/OT or a stack of dps on your assigned side)
Step 6b: Move to Twintania and continue your rotation.
Step 6: Blue circle goes out on someone's head. If you go to step 7a. If not go to 7b.
Step 7a: Move under twintania in the middle of her target ring.
Step 7b: Take a couple steps back to ensure you do not end up inside conflag. Target and dps conflag once it appears.
Step 8: DPS conflag until someone gets a red triangle over their head. If you go to step 9a. If not go to step 9b.
Step 9a: Move to designated fireball drop point (likely a pile of pets/OT or a stack of dps on your assigned side)
Step 9b: Continue dpsing conflag until it dies.
Step 10: Once conflag is dead go back to dpsing Twin.
Step 11: Blue circle goes out on someone's head. If you go to step 12a. If not go to 12b.
Step 12a: Move under twintania in the middle of her target ring.
Step 12b: Take a couple steps back to ensure you do not end up inside conflag. Target and dps conflag once it appears. This is a short conflag pop short burns and dps conflag until it dies.
Step 13: repeat Steps 6-12 until a 2nd collar piece drops.
Step 14: Move to divebomb position (designated before pull)
Step 15: When green circle appears (or if you have Twin on focus as soon as she appears back on focus target) run forward 10 steps.
Step 16: Move back to divebomb position.
Step 17: Repeat steps 15 and 16 two more times.
Step 18: Target large snake in middle and while positioning at divebomb position dps for 45 seconds.
Step 19: Repeat steps 15 and 16 two more times while continuing to dps large snake.
Step 20: Repeat step 15 but this time continue running forward following the tanks and dpsing the large snake.
Step 21: Kill large snake. (don't worry about small snakes Mr. Melee the casters will handle them)
Step 22: stand in one of the previously dropped collar pieces until Twin finishes her cast.
Step 23: Attack Twin until she begins to cast Twister.
Step 24: Once twister begins casting run without crossing your own or anyone elses path until cast finishes.
Step 25: Go back to dpsing Twin while avoiding any green markers on the ground you may see.
Step 26: Dreadknight will spawn in the middle of the room. Run away from it until it has picked its target. If you go to step 27a. If not go to 27b.
Step 27a: Your stun locked. Enjoy the break to regen some TP and cheer your fellow dps on for keeping you from dying a horrible death.
Step 27b: One of your friends is stun locked!!!! Shoulder Tackle or Jump to that mean Dreadknight and kill it before your poor friend meets an untimely death.
Step 28: Repeat steps 23-27 until the final piece of collar drops.
Step 29: No more of those annoying twisters or Dreadknights! DPS twintania to victory! If she starts shooting fireballs at you see Step 30.
Step 30: FIRE RUN!!!!!!! (until it stops at least then back to Step 29!)

[NaliaBrown]

How long have you all spent as a group engaged on these fights? Because if it's less than 10 hours... It is easy you need to put more time in. If it's more than 20 hours your group has someone in it who is very very slow and/or not a raider.

We raid 2 nights a week for about 2 hours a night. We've been doing Turn 5 since 2.2 came out. We have had some turnover in ranks - we've had to replace both tanks and a bard in that time. Last night one of our tanks couldn't make it, so we subbed in a tank from our FC who had never done it before. To his credit, he caught on quickly and only got hit by a couple dive bombs, but overall we didn't get to the twister phase.

I did find out that 2 of our people (BRD and SCH) ran Turn 5 with a pug group the night before and beat it, so now they've got some tips for us to modify our techniques. Maybe that's the push we'll need to finally get past this.

But, really - it's not EASY to me. Not at all. But I guess I'm just not very good.

[HeroSamson]

what makes me mad about this game, is the fact it relies too heavy on tank and healers.

what I mean is in FFXI at least you could hold off a monster with dragoon or a dps class long enough to get your tank back up, even if they have weakness you could tank half decent.

here its like no damn chance, your healer or tank die you are brown bread you ain't tanking anything with any dps its a few cracks your dead, even healer cant heal you up good enough and raise at the same time and have enough mp to keep curing.

but I deal with it, though still think its messed up also.

when you get echo buff, I some how feel its a illusion, the monsters seem to hit even harder with it on. its just there to give people a sense of comfort, I honestly believe that.

[Zarzak]

what makes me mad about this game, is the fact it relies too heavy on tank and healers.

what I mean is in FFXI at least you could hold off a monster with dragoon or a dps class long enough to get your tank back up, even if they have weakness you could tank half decent.
here its like no damn chance, your healer or tank die you are brown bread you ain't tanking anything with any dps its a few cracks your dead, even healer cant heal you up good enough and raise at the same time and have enough mp to keep curing.

but I deal with it, though still think its messed up also.

when you get echo buff, I some how feel its a illusion, the monsters seem to hit even harder with it on. its just there to give people a sense of comfort, I honestly believe that.

I'll agree I miss the EQ/FFXI classes before the cut and dry archtypes were introduced with WoW. (I don't remember in FFXI but in EQ.. the difference between a "tank" warrior and a "dps" warrior was which one of them hit taunt. The tank was doing equal if not higher (due to riposte) dps to the "dps" warrior and any hybrid that was the result of mixing a tank class with anything else (such as ranger being a warrior/druid hybrid) could in a pinch tank just as well. And outside of a raid situation could be full out tanks with a little extra healing.

That being said I did have one epic Titan ex back in 2.1 where 1 tank got knocked off right before 2nd add set. So the drg got one add and I (monk) for the 2nd. Then the other tank got knocked off and I went into full monk tank mode and kept it going for 8-9% (thank you healers!) until the 2nd MB hit me at like 1% and the drg got the final couple seconds of glory.